clarafok
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Q23 - Roxanne: To protect declining elephant

by clarafok Thu Dec 30, 2010 3:27 am

hello,

can someone please explain to me why the answer is B and not D?
i'm a little confused about 'decreased demand' because roxanne says that people concerned about such endangered species should not buy new ivory, and purchasing antique ivory provides no incentive to poachers to obtain more new ivory, which to me meant - increasing the demand for antique ivory to decrease the demand for new ivory. and salvador thinks that refraining from buying any ivory at all would ensure the demand for new ivory to drop. so how is it that their points differ about decreasing demand? is D wrong because it says 'widespread refusal'?

thanks! :lol:
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Re: Q23 - Roxanne: To protect declining elephant

by bbirdwell Mon Jan 03, 2011 6:05 pm

The short answer to your question is that (D) cannot be right because we have no evidence in either argument of a "substantial effect on the survival of elephants."

Even if you ignore the "survival of.." part of the answer choice and ballpark it, you should not choose this answer. If anything, Roxanne thinks that refusal to buy new ivory is a good thing for elephants, and Salvador thinks that refusal to buy any kind of ivory is a good thing for elephants. Therefore, they would actually be likely to agree on this point.

To understand why (B) is correct, let's get the arguments straight:

Roxanne:
1. People who care about elephants should not buy new ivory.
2. Markets for new ivory and old ivory are totally independent.
3. Because of (2), buying old ivory does not provide an incentive to poachers, and it is therefore ok to buy old ivory.

Salvador:
1. Demand for old ivory is greater than supply.
2. People who don't care about elephants are buying new ivory since old ivory is not available.
3. People who care about elephants should not buy old ivory, which will cause the demand for new ivory to stop. (ostensibly because then old ivory would be available to the people who don't care about elephants)

Now, consider each point and ask yourself if the other party would agree or disagree -- keeping in mind that you may not know either way.

Roxanne
1. Salvador would definitely agree.
2. We don't know what Salvador thinks.
3. Salvador definitely disagrees -- he thinks concerned people should buy no ivory at all.

Salvador
1. We don't know what Roxanne's opinion is.
2. Ditto.
3. Roxanne definitely disagrees.

Now, at least in our minds, it's clear. We cannot predict what the correct answer will say, but it must somehow say that these two disagree about the purchase of old ivory and what effect it might have.

(B) is exactly what Salvador says in his conclusion. Roxanne, however, thinks that the markets are entirely independent, which contradicts this statement.
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Re: PT 37, S2, Q23

by clarafok Wed Jan 05, 2011 10:21 am

thank you!
 
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Re: Q23 - Roxanne: To protect declining elephant

by lebleu.simon Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:12 pm

Hello,

With regards to AC (E), I am having a little trouble as to why they would not argue on this!

Thank you in advance,

Simon
 
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Re: Q23 - Roxanne: To protect declining elephant

by peterkeffer Tue Jul 15, 2014 3:33 pm

Hey Simon,

I also chose E on my first go through the practice test. After doing some review, I think this is why the answer choice is wrong.

E claims that "people concerned about endangered species should refuse to buy ivory objects that are less than 75 year old."

Re-reading the passages, it seems that both Roxanne and Salvador agree over this point. Roxanne: "only antique ivory - that which is at least 75 years old - can be bought." Salvador: "People should [...] refrain from buying any ivory at all."

Whereas Roxanne explicitly bars the purchase of ivory that is less than 75 years old, Salvador bars the purchase of all ivory. Accordingly, they'd both agree that people concerned about endangered species should refuse to buy ivory objects that are less than 75 year old.

B is correct because it highlights a point of contention between Roxanne and Salvador. Roxanne claims that the new and old ivory markets are entirely independent whereas Salvador claims that those who would prefer to buy old ivory are being forced to buy new ivory because the current demand for old ivory exceeds the supply.

I hope this helps!

Peter
 
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Re: Q23 - Roxanne: To protect declining elephant

by roflcoptersoisoi Mon Jul 04, 2016 9:25 am

Roxanne's reasoning: The markets for new and old ivory are independent, so buying old ivory gives poachers no incentive to obtain new ivory.
Roxanne's point: Only antique ivory (ivory that is at least 75 years old) can be bought in good conscious
Salvador's point: People who are concerned with the survival of elephants should refrain from buying any ivory, thereby ensuring a reduction in demand for new ivory.
Salvador's reasoning: Current demand for old ivory exceeds supply so many people that are not concerned about the survival of elephants are buying new ivory.

Point at issue: Whether people who are concerned about the survival of elephants should continue buying any ivory (including antique ivory)


(A) None of them make this contention.
(B) this looks good. Roxanne would disagree because she argues the markets are independent, Salvador would agree because demand for old ivory exceeds supply so many people who would prefer old ivory are buying new one. As a solution she says people could stop buying ivory which would reduce demand of both old and new ivory. keep for now
(C) This is not a point of disagreement, if anything they both seem to agree but disagree on how to achieve this feat. Roxanne thinks this can be achieved by buying old ivory, salvador thinks this could be achieved by not buying any ivory
(D) This is not a point of disagreement, if anything they both seem to agree on this.
(E) Same as D

Although I was not 100 percent sure of (B) all the other answer are clearly wrong so it must be the correct answer.

Let's confirm it:
Roxanne: New and old ivory markets are independent, so if you are concerned about the survival of elephants but want to keep buying ivory then you should purchase old ivory since demand has not effect on the other market.
Salvador: This is complete BS. New and old ivory markets are not independent, the contrary, because the excess demand in the old ivory markets has caused people who don't give a shit about elephants to buy new ivory. Therefore to address this, if you're concerned about the survival of species, stop buying ivory to reduce demand of new ivory (by presumably also reducing demand for old ivory).