Diagram

[sethgrant]

The one that starts with a Study and has 6 conditions -


I am having trouble finding necessary inferences to really attack this game - can someone help me - there is so much conditional logic I am having trouble knowing what to do with it

[sethgrant]

I figured it out, it just took a while...

[noah]

From the time stamp, it seemed to only take you 6 minutes! If you have a moment, it'd be great to know what you figured out that unlocked the game . . .

[sethgrant]

I realized that if G were first, then H was out and if H was out then M was also out.... thus I knew 5 out of the 7

If F is first, K is out.

I guess it was frustrating because I wasnt able to make that many inferences and did a lot of guess and check...

[nneamakaeze]

hello noah...can you provide the diagram for the inital game about consumer group tests? im having trouble figuring how to represent the conditional logic its a bit confusing since there are 7 medications for 5 spots. Thank you


Also, for the 3rd game(binary grouping involving the animals) could you please explain the answer to the very last question?

[noah]

Here's the diagram for the consumer group study. The key is to see the binary nature of the conditional statements and therefore create two diagrams.

See if you can re-create these on your own.

Good luck and tell me if you have any future questions.

[cardsfan04]

I'm going to ask a really vague question, and it may be that the answer is just that I need to practice these more.

I've been doing really well on the ordered numbering, but this one through me for a loop because of the 2 that aren't used. Eventually, I came up with the same diagram, but it took me way too long to get there. To give perspective, I took all 4 games for the session 3 HW together, timing it as if it were 1 35 minute section. I was through the first 3 sections in 20 minutes, but only answered three of these questions in the final 15 minutes, and one of them was wrong.

I understand how you get the frames. And, once I got them, I was able to get all 5 questions right. But, should I be attacking this differently than a typical ordered numbering? I have a feeling this is mixing a concept in a chapter I haven't gotten to yet in the LG book. I certainly hope so anyway lol.

[a3friedm]

Noah made this game look easy, i'm embarrassed. Completely missed the F/G inferences...

[doug.feng]

I'm looking at the diagrams provided in the back of the logic games book, in comparison to the pdf above, and they were able to infer into frames:

F#1: F L I H M/G | K G/M
F#2: G L (I, K-F) | H M

For the first frame, can anybody see how they were able to put that together, instead of having just I floating in the cloud?

it seems like the one above missed a step (that would have made the first orientation question really easy)

[ohthatpatrick]

For the F in 1 frame, we start with

F L (_ I _ ) | K _

F being 1st send K OUT (I know you know this, just being thorough).

Who's left?

M, H, G

We have the conditional rule
M --> H and F

So there's a couple ways to think to yourself why H must be IN.

1. The contrapositive of that rule is
~H or ~F --> ~M

Since there's only one OUT spot left, we can't put H OUT. That would force M OUT as well, overflowing the OUT column.

2. M is either IN or OUT. If M is IN, then H is IN, according to the rule. If M is OUT, then H and G are IN, because they're the two that are left.

This deduction is nice but definitely qualifies as "hard to see, easy to miss" ... we try not to included EVERY deduction when we show a game setup because it's unrealistic to think that you always see everything up-front.

So this deduction was omitted from the other diagram for realism's sake and included in the book diagram for the sake of being thorough.

Make sense?