The loan company

[whezgyba]

Hi Ron,
I'm confused about the"such" with the other prep question attached below:

The success of the program to eradicate smallpox has stimulated experts to
pursue what they had not previously considered possible -- better control, if not eradication, of the other infections such as measles and yaws.

A. what they had not previously considered possible -- better control, if not eradication, of the other infections such as
B. what they had not previously considered a possibility -- better control, if not eradication, of such infections like
C. something they had not previously considered possible -- better control, if not eradication, of such infections as
D. something not considered a previous possibility -- better control and perhaps eradication, of other infections such as
E. the possibility of what they had not previously considered possible - better control and possibly eradication of infections like

OA:C.

But in choice C, no previous referring about "such infections"....

Do I mix two structures "such a noun" and "such X as Y"?

[RonPurewal]

"such infections as measles and yaws" fits the latter template perfectly.

"x" = infections
"y" = measles and yaws

so, i don't understand what you are asking. what do you think is being "mixed"?

[ysyanshi]

(d) and (e) are unidiomatic; you can't write "proven records that they..."?

Hi Ron, could you please explain more about why "proven records that they..." is unidiomatic? Than you very much.

[ysyanshi]

Also, can I state another reason why A and D is incorrect is that "...time, known as..." does not make sense. My understanding is COMMA+VERBed modifies the noun immediately preceding the COMMA, so that its usage is same as "which VERBed". Here the meaning of the sentence becomes "the time is known as the subprime lending market", an expression making no sense.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

[RonPurewal]

^^ there's more flexibility than that in the use of -ed modifiers.

but, don't forget that the problems are multiple-choice!

if you compare that placement with the alternative -- in which "a group" is situated optimally -- you'll realize that there's a clear winner and a clear loser, there.

[aflaamM589]

hello experts,
Is the usage if that in DE also problematic?
Thanks

[RonPurewal]

sorry, i don't understand what you are asking. "if that"?
i don't see the word "if" anywhere in this problem.

please clarify, thanks.

[aflaamM589]

sorry for typo,
Is the usage of that in DE also problematic?
D) The loan company announced it would soon lend money to borrowers with proven records that they do not pay back their loans on time,

[RonPurewal]

yeah, that's not a valid usage.

it's far easier, though, to eliminate that version on the grounds that it's clearly inferior to the version in the choices above it. https://www.manhattanprep.com/gmat/foru ... ml#p118104

[aflaamM589]

Ron,thanks for your reply
Further, is'nt such a group seems to modify time in E?
loans on time ,such a group collectively known as the subprime lending market

[RonPurewal]

well, it doesn't matter, because "such a group" is incorrect there anyway.

"such a/an X" means that you've given just one example of some more general group or category.

in other words, "such a/an X" is used only when "X" is one of many possible examples of something.

e.g., let's say you're reading an MBA admissions blog.
Meet Michelle. She has xxxxx work experience, yyyy GMAT scores, and zzzzz other things on her application. Today we'll talk about the schools to which such a person should reasonably apply.
the point here ^^ is that the discussion doesn't just apply to michelle; it also applies to anyone else who's like her in the ways described. she is just one example, of many.

that is decidedly NOT what's happening in this sentence. this isn't just one group out of many groups satisfying a certain description; this is one group that has a certain name. so, "such a group" is WRONG here.
there's no sense in even trying to define what it modifies, because ... it's wrong.

[aflaamM589]

Great explanation Ron. Thanks
Also, since we are on it and just for the sake of understanding this construction( comma such), i want to ask does it modify the immediate preceding noun, time in this case?

Moreover, C is also incorrect, apart from wrong usage of such, because it incorrectly use comma with and thus comma with now makes sense neither as adjectival nor as adverbial.
i.e neither it modifies the preceding noun nor does it modify the preceding clause.
Is my understanding correct?
Appreciate your help.

[RonPurewal]

well, if you have a correct use of "such a group", then, clearly, it's going to have to describe some sort of group -- so, it's going to have to describe a noun that's in there somewhere (referring to a group of people/things).
i don't think "such a/an xxx" is going to be subject to extremely strict rules of placement. if they're going to test that kind of construction, they'll be much more likely to test it in the way they're testing it here -- in terms of usage/meaning, rather than in terms of grammatical considerations.

yes, "with" is also ungrammatical here.

[Crisc419]

Ron said:
//////
if you substitute "such a group" for "a group", then that's incorrect, because "such" wouldn't be referring to anything.
///////
I understand that we can use "SUCH A NOUN" only when NOUN exists in an early place.

"such a group" in E is wrong because there is no word " group" in the early part of the sentence

the following must be correct:
I like the group of students and such a group can be a good community

Ron, experts, pls, confirm my above thinking. Thank you.

as long as you mention some specific "X" earlier in the sentence, then "such an X" is fine, yes.

another example:
i have no problem with using a standard geometry textbook; indeed, such a book is helpful in providing ready-made sets of practice problems.
--> "such a book" is legitimate because the sentence has mentioned a particular book (namely, a standard geometry textbook).

why "such a group" in choice E cannot refer to "borrowers with proven records of not paying back......"?

Pls clarify.

thanks a million.

[RonPurewal]

that question is answered three or four posts up. please read the entire thread before asking questions! thank you.

the answer is this:

"such a/an X" means that you've given just one example of some more general group or category.

in other words, "such a/an X" is used only when "X" is one of many possible examples of something.

e.g., let's say you're reading an MBA admissions blog.
Meet Michelle. She has xxxxx work experience, yyyy GMAT scores, and zzzzz other things on her application. Today we'll talk about the schools to which such a person should reasonably apply.
the point here ^^ is that the discussion doesn't just apply to michelle; it also applies to anyone else who's like her in the ways described. she is just one example, of many.

that is decidedly NOT what's happening in this sentence. this isn't just one group out of many groups satisfying a certain description; this is one group that has a certain name. so, "such a group" is WRONG here.