TArget 750+

[sam198518]

Hi,

My problem is I have been very inconsistent in preparing for the test. I started studying for gmat in January; studied for 3-4weeks and then had to let go because of work load. I tried to pick it(prep) up again in April; studied for another 3-4 weeks and then couldn't continue.
Now, I'm starting again and want to figure out areas to work on. Here is the summary of my test scores:
800score test: 620(before starting prep)(Q51, V29)
Mgmat free test: 640
Mgmat test1: 680
GmatPrep: 710(Q50, V36)
mgmat test2 : 680 (Q50, V33)

In all these tests - I have scored either 50 or 51 in Quant, so I'm assuming I'm goo to go except will need to touch it in the end.

In all these tests my verbal score has ranged from 29 to 36. My scores in RC has improved as I have practiced more n more questions, however, there has not been much improvement in SC or CR mostly because of time constraints. I say time constraint is the reason because when I do practice questions, I do pretty well - usually 8-9 correct of 10 questions but in tests the correction rate is 50-60% only.

What I have done wrong till now? What should i be doing next? Ways to improve SC/CR scores?(One thing that I have recently started is practicing questions in timed fashion)


Thanks & Regards,
Syed

[StaceyKoprince]

The two big holes I see right now:
(1) inconsistency
(2) materials / study plan

The inconsistency is obviously a big problem. Why do you think that has happened twice now? Were there two unforeseeable / uncontrollable things, or might there be some difficulty with motivation? (Nothing to be ashamed about - I find it difficult to get motivated to study, too. A lot of people take classes so that they'll be accountable to someone for doing the work every week!)

For the materials / study plan, that's not necessarily a problem... but I just don't know what you're doing. What materials are you using? How have you studied so far? The only two things I know you've done are (1) take practice tests, and (2) doing timed practice questions. What are you using to help you learn HOW to get better at verbal? (Not practice questions. Lessons created for the GMAT that teach you how to get better at taking the GMAT. Practice questions test what you have learned, but they don't actually teach you.)

Take a look at this article:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... tudy-plan/

Next, I agree that you're looking good for quant. :) For verbal, use the below article to analyze your most recent MGMAT test (and tell me whether you took that test under 100% official conditions, including essays). When you're done, come back here and share your analysis:

http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... ice-tests/

[sam198518]

The two big holes I see right now:
(1) inconsistency
(2) materials / study plan

The inconsistency is obviously a big problem. Why do you think that has happened twice now? Were there two unforeseeable / uncontrollable things, or might there be some difficulty with motivation? (Nothing to be ashamed about - I find it difficult to get motivated to study, too. A lot of people take classes so that they'll be accountable to someone for doing the work every week!)

For the materials / study plan, that's not necessarily a problem... but I just don't know what you're doing. What materials are you using? How have you studied so far? The only two things I know you've done are (1) take practice tests, and (2) doing timed practice questions. What are you using to help you learn HOW to get better at verbal? (Not practice questions. Lessons created for the GMAT that teach you how to get better at taking the GMAT. Practice questions test what you have learned, but they don't actually teach you.)

Take a look at this article:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... tudy-plan/

Next, I agree that you're looking good for quant. :) For verbal, use the below article to analyze your most recent MGMAT test (and tell me whether you took that test under 100% official conditions, including essays). When you're done, come back here and share your analysis:

http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... ice-tests/

Hi Stacey,

Thank you so much for giving so much thought to my problem and I apologies for delayed response - I did not check the "Notify me when a reply is posted" box while submitting this query.

1) Inconsistency has definitely been a big problem. I had to leave the prep first time because of family reasons and the second time I was changing job so as to make my profile more suitable for a Business School. Motivation has not been a problem; I'm 100% sure, I want to tread this path.

2) I have been through:
Mgmat SC, CR & RC(not so thoroughly), OG-12, Verbal Review-2nd Ed(revised too).

Strategy: If I go wrong in solving a question; I give it a second try and then look for solution either on mgmat webaite or google.

PLAN as per the 1st link u shared:
I need to Score at least 750, so an increase of 60-70 marks in next 4-6 weeks.

Need to start essay too with proper 8min breaks.Go to library to simulate test experience.

Strength - Quant

Weakness - Verbal
SC - Strengthening questions in CR because options contain information from outside the argument
RC - Really bad at some of the RC's - yet to figure out the type
SC - time constraint make me go wrong during test - correction rate 8-9 of 10 when untimed & 6 of 10 during test

Overall, time constraint has been pulling down my Verbal score.

Strategy: Do as many questions as possible.

Still to look at application deadlines & Evaluation practice test link that you shared


Thank you so much for your help; please do post your thoughts on my strategy/analysis.

[sam198518]

Hi Stacey,

Here is a quick summary from the first three mgmat tests:
[*]
Type Q# Time Right: Wrong
CR 13 28:56:00 9 to 4
RC 12 26:20:00 6 to 6
SC 12 19:00:00 5 to 12

CR 14 30:42:00 7 to 7
RC 12 26:42:00 8 to 4
SC 15 17:32:00 8 to 7

CR 14 27:39:00 7 to 7
RC 12 26:36:00 7 to 5
SC 15 20:37:00 8 to 7

[StaceyKoprince]

You need to give me your analysis, not just the data. Go through all of the data yourself and figure out what it means (using that article as a guide). It's important for you to learn how to analyze this data yourself and figure out what to do about it. (And, after you tell me your analysis, I'll tell you whether I think you're right - so that you can get better at analyzing your own performance - and then we'll talk about what to do about it.)

Also, just looking at that data you posted - that's your own data that you added up? Total time spent and # right vs. # wrong? That information is not enough for us to tell anything at all, really. Go read the article I linked to last time. :)

I need to Score at least 750, so an increase of 60-70 marks in next 4-6 weeks.

I'm going to tell you what I tell anyone who tells me they want a 750: you can't put a precise timeframe on it. It's *incredibly* hard to get that kind of score. It's a lot easier to go from 600 to 670 than from 700 to 750.

Read this article: http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/7 ... erence.cfm

Strategy: If I go wrong in solving a question; I give it a second try and then look for solution either on mgmat webaite or google.
Strategy: Do as many questions as possible.

Okay, we need to adjust your approach. You need to review EVERY question, not just the ones you got wrong. This article discusses what you need to review for every question.

http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/a ... roblem.cfm

Next, getting to 750 is not about doing as many questions as possible. The people who get to that level have done a lot of problems, yes, but they have spent a TON of time actually studying / analyzing problems. I might spend 15 minutes analyzing a single question (even if I got it right!). If you really want to get to that level, you will have to learn to think like me. :) That means actively picking apart test questions, looking for more efficient ways to do them, learning how to recognize different but related future problems, etc. Read that article I linked above (the one about the difference between a 700 and a 760) for more.

[sam198518]

Ok, In all my previous tests I found Reading comprehension as the weakest portion - It has been taking almost 10min per RC with around 50% correction rate. Within RC inference questions & Main point questions are where I was taking more time & was going wrong.

The other weakness that I saw was Strengthening/Weakiening Questions.

Also, I always have felt relatively less confident when attempting Tense problems.

So, I went through Thursdays with Ron session on RC's main point, Strengthen/weaken CR and solving SC using just Tense.

The result after taking KNewton test: Total - 710
Q 49 (used 52 of 75 min)
V 37 (used 71 of 75 min)

2 wrong in Quant: 1 was silly mistake the other was actually a little complex.

6 wrong in Verbal:
4 wrong from RC - 3 of which are Inference Questions & 1 deny an assumption of author.
2 wrong from CR - One affirming an assumption the other denying an assumption - Both are a little long paragrpah.
Amazingly no mistake in SC for the first time. :) the only solace in my troubled life :P

This test does confirm my earlier hypothesis that Inference from RC is a weakness. However, I'm not quite sure on CR's assumption question; I usually am good at assumption questions but made 2 mistakes this time, so, I'm thinking long paragraph might have contributed to these 2 mistakes.

[jnelson0612]

Syed, you did a great analysis. I'm filling in for Stacey for the next few days; do you have a specific question I can help you with?

[sam198518]

Syed, you did a great analysis. I'm filling in for Stacey for the next few days; do you have a specific question I can help you with?

Well, thank you so much; you answered my question, which was whether the way I'm doing analysis is good enough or not.

[StaceyKoprince]

Yes, I liked your analysis, too. :) Keep it up!

You mention some issues with RC inference and some CRs. These articles may help:

Intro to RC:
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/04/ ... mp-passage
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/07/ ... rc-passage

RC Infer:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/a ... estion.cfm

CR Assump:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/CR-assumption.cfm

CR Strengthen:
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2011/04/ ... en-problem

CR Weaken:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... r-problem/

[sam198518]

I started my prep again after this long gap because of job change & an accident in which I lost my car.

took my first grockit test, scored 700; the interesting part is score distribution:
SC 15 4(wrong) -
2 questions were pretty tough
1 simple question required "but" and I chose "and" to bring contrast
the other simple question required "but" and I chose "although"

CR 14 1(wrong) - question was a little ambigous coz a lot of students said they interpreted question in another direction.

RC 12 8(wrong)
RC1 - 3 of 3 wrong
RC2 - 3 of 3 wrong
RC3 - 1 of 3 wrong
RC4 - 1 of 3 wrong

RC1,2 were pretty tough - advanced experiment by scientists but most importantly i chose wrong option cause when passage asked for "According to the passage" I didn't that it is asking me to infer. Anyway, my next step would be to do a lot of RCs; however boring they may look I need to connect with them and need to be more careful with inference RC.

Looking at the test score and strongly feeling that I do not want to keep studying(cause each time I leave stidies and try to comeback it takes double effort) for gmat I have taken my test day as 28th dec.

[sam198518]

Thanks a lot Stacey!

I think Ron's video and your blog helped a lot; I'll visit again your RC Infer link and Ron's RC infer video.

Yes, I liked your analysis, too. :) Keep it up!

You mention some issues with RC inference and some CRs. These articles may help:

Intro to RC:
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/04/ ... mp-passage
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/07/ ... rc-passage

RC Infer:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/a ... estion.cfm

CR Assump:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/CR-assumption.cfm

CR Strengthen:
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2011/04/ ... en-problem

CR Weaken:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... r-problem/

[StaceyKoprince]

good luck - let us know how it goes!

[sam198518]

good luck - let us know how it goes!

Thank you!

I took mgmat test 1 & again the test score was 700(49Q & 36V) with a little variation in the topic score distribution.
RC 5(right) & 7(wrong) - I gave full time to RC(30min) because I have been studying it for last 1week and because it was the weakest. Clearly, the rc has improved a lil but the lost time pulled my sc/cr score slightly.

My untimed correction rate in RC has improved a lot(around 75%) in last one week, but I didn't do well in the timed environment.

My next step would be to do more untimed RC and then do a lot of timed RC while intermittently touching the SC/CR. My quant score has gone down a lil too but I plan to work on verbal continiously and then pick up Quant just before test day.


Stacey,
I didn't do as well in CR as I generally do and the reason is long CR passage with quite a bit info. and that too within less time because RC consumed a lot of my time. Can you please recommend a mgmat CR book for such type of questions.

Note: I have been through mgmat CR book, OG verbal, OG-12 and have recently picked up kaplan's 800 from library.

[StaceyKoprince]

Okay, so the next thing to hit on RC is timing - as you know, it's not good enough to get things right too slowly, since that just means other things wrong elsewhere!

How can you streamline RC? Where are you spending most of your time now? On the initial readthrough? Taking notes? Understanding the question? Finding and re-reading material in the passage? Evaluating the answer choices? Your first pass through the answers? Or the last couple of answers that you compare against each other?

My next step would be to do more untimed RC

No. Timed. Timing is part of the strategy. Don't tell me "I need to learn how to get them all right first and then I'll learn how to do it faster." No, you really won't. :) You need to learn how to get *enough* right in an appropriate time. You WILL get some wrong not because you can't do them but because you can't do them IN TIME. That's okay!

I didn't do as well in CR as I generally do and the reason is long CR passage with quite a bit info.

Actually, you didn't do as well because of timing - and not just the RC timing problem. You should have let this problem go. You hit a really hard / long / annoying problem? Say "Nice shot!" to the computer and move on to the next one, especially if you're already struggling with the time! If you're on time, you can still spend the normal 2 minutes, but no longer, and you should feel absolutely fine about getting this one wrong in 2 minutes or less!

You only need to answer about 60% of the questions correctly - the computer is going to "win" about 40% of the points! If you keep approaching this as though you need to win more points, then you're always going to struggle with time and you're always going to underperform. Pretend you're playing tennis - you don't expect to win all the points, you know your opponent will win a bunch, and you can say "Nice shot!" and get ready for the next point when the computer does win one.

Finally, you asked me for a book for a "long CR passage with quite a bit info." Any CR passage for any question type could be long - you're going to need to give me a bit more. What specific type of CR question was it? Also, the font for that part was in blue. Did you try to include a link to the actual question there? The text itself is not a link. Let me know.

[sam198518]

Hi Stacey,
I can't thank you enough for giving so much thought to my problem.

Okay, so the next thing to hit on RC is timing - as you know, it's not good enough to get things right too slowly, since that just means other things wrong elsewhere!

How can you streamline RC? Where are you spending most of your time now? On the initial readthrough? Taking notes? Understanding the question? Finding and re-reading material in the passage? Evaluating the answer choices? Your first pass through the answers? Or the last couple of answers that you compare against each other?
No. Timed. Timing is part of the strategy. Don't tell me "I need to learn how to get them all right first and then I'll learn how to do it faster." No, you really won't. :) You need to learn how to get *enough* right in an appropriate time. You WILL get some wrong not because you can't do them but because you can't do them IN TIME. That's okay!

As per your suggestion I attempted 2 timed RC to come up with better analysis. I had fixed the timer for 15min, but it took me 17.5min to complete both RCs. If I were to rate I'll rate these two RCs at moderate difficulty(options not so close but long passage).
RC1: 2C 1W
RC2: 2C 1W

It took me 3min to finish reading long passage for the 1st time.
I invested more time in finding the topic of question and understanding the context.

To my understading difficult RCs will have both close options and long paragrpahs.
Sometimes, I'm spending more time in searching for the answer & its context for long passage and sometimes it's really hard to eliminate one of the last two options.


Does it mean I'm not making a good memory map at first read?
I used to write down paragraph's main point but felt that I wasn't using my written points to figure out the right paragraph to look at, so I stopped writing down.

Actually, you didn't do as well because of timing - and not just the RC timing problem. You should have let this problem go. You hit a really hard / long / annoying problem? Say "Nice shot!" to the computer and move on to the next one, especially if you're already struggling with the time! If you're on time, you can still spend the normal 2 minutes, but no longer, and you should feel absolutely fine about getting this one wrong in 2 minutes or less!

You only need to answer about 60% of the questions correctly - the computer is going to "win" about 40% of the points! If you keep approaching this as though you need to win more points, then you're always going to struggle with time and you're always going to underperform. Pretend you're playing tennis - you don't expect to win all the points, you know your opponent will win a bunch, and you can say "Nice shot!" and get ready for the next point when the computer does win one.

But 60% correction rate is not good enough?

Finally, you asked me for a book for a "long CR passage with quite a bit info." Any CR passage for any question type could be long - you're going to need to give me a bit more. What specific type of CR question was it?

1 weaken, 1 strengthen & 1 assumption questions were wrong partly because of big passage(85 words) - I felt that this was a generic problem and that I need to practice more such problems; I recently picked up LSAT logic reasoning bible for this.

Also, I started revisioning mgmat SC book; no quant for now as I've 32 days to go.