Need Help/Guidence 660 :(

[gitanshuoberoi]

HI Manhattan Instructors,

Who am I?

I have enrolled for MGMAT 6 CAT series. Have been seriously preparing for GMAT since March '10. Brushed up my basis in Quants using 4GMAT math books. For verbal Done with OG's, CR bible,SC - Manhattan SC. RC practice from OG's. Still working on stuff from gmat club for verbal and Quants.

Score so far.

Gave GMAT prep ( covering basic - May ) 620 V 28 Q 48

Since then working on weak areas ( almost all :) ) given 3 MGMAT CATS. Scores as follows

CAT 1 13 june 640 V 34 Q 43
CAT 2 27 June 640 V 34 Q 43
CAT 3 24 July 660 V 35 Q 45

M looking for target score of around min 680, reaching 700 +.
I have not yet scheduled the exam but want to give it in around 1.5 - 2 months.

Does it looks achievable ? I know its too vague question. Let me know if i can give u my test analysis data to guide me.

Thanks in advance
GO

[greystealth]

That's a pretty great verbal score given your English!

Where are you from?

[StaceyKoprince]

Yes, I think it's possible for you to get to 680+ given the data you've provided. I have a few questions for you.

Did you take your practice tests under full official conditions, including essays? If you deviated from official conditions, tell us how. (Depending upon how you deviated, your score may be artificially inflated - so your "true" scoring range may be lower than what is reflected on your practice tests. If that's the case, it's important to know that now.)

Next, read this article and perform the analysis on your most recent MGMAT test. Then, come back here and share your results. (Note: do NOT just post the data from the reports. Do the actual analysis described. This is an important skill for you to learn.)

http://www.beatthegmat.com/a/2009/09/23 ... tice-tests

Tell us what you think you need to do based upon that analysis (again, the ability to figure out what to do is an important skill to develop!). Then, we'll tell you what we think you should do - when we agree with you, you'll know you were able to diagnose yourself well, and when we disagree, you'll learn better ways for interpreting the data. :)

[gitanshuoberoi]

Hi Stacey.

Thanks for the feedback. I read your blog and tried to do the analysis.Though everything looks bad but some things which look to me killer are..

1. Quants - Time is killing me loudly rather openly !!

2. Verbal - RC and CR accuracy is poor from my pov !!

Below is a detail review of what I analysed.
HI ,
Here is my analysis based on the article and comparing my last CAT - 3
"First, naturally, I look at the score. I also check whether the student did the essays ... "
- No I did not take the essay's in CAT. Took longer break than 10 mins ( 15 min Went for a quick fag )between Quants and verbal. :( Ill make sure I do the essay on next teat and no extra long break.


"Next, I look at the problem lists for the quant and verbal sections..."
[b]- Quants ---> [/b]
Encountered two incorrect strings
First string - 4 questions, Q 10 to Q 13 .
9 DS Is PQRS A Parallelogram 700 - 800 1:58 20:28 18:00 Polygons 96 Correct
10 DS Absolutely Less Than Zero (2) 700 - 800 1:29 21:57 20:00 Basic Equations 87 Incorrect
11 PS No Mean Feat (2) 700 - 800 2:47 24:44 22:00 Statistics 83 Incorrect
12 DS Digit Dilemma 700 - 800 3:04 27:48 24:00 Digits 80 Incorrect
13 PS Lengthy Problems 700 - 800 3:37 31:25 26:00 Divisibility and Primes 76 Incorrect
14 PS Club Requirement 600 - 700 4:44 36:09 28:00 Overlapping Sets 79 Correct

Then from Q 28 - 37 I have another string of almost 8 Q( with 2 q correct in between ) - I was left with 10 min whn I started Q 28.I tried to solve these questions later after the test and could solve 5 Q of 8 Incorrect without looking at solution.Seems like I loose my accuracy.

28 DS Absolutely Less 700 - 800 1:07 66:49 56:00 Inequalities 83 Incorrect
29 PS Probability Triangle 700 - 800 0:38 67:27 58:00 Triangles and Diagonals 82 Incorrect
30 PS Money Grows 700 - 800 1:31 68:58 60:00 Percents 80 Incorrect
31 PS Even Multiples of 15 700 - 800 1:17 70:15 62:00 Consecutive Integers 79 Incorrect
32 PS Forwards and Guards 700 - 800 1:32 71:47 64:00 Combinatorics 80 Correct
33 PS Odd Or Even Median 600 - 700 0:06 71:53 66:00 Odds and Evens 79 Incorrect
34 DS Absolute Distance 700 - 800 0:20 72:13 68:00 Basic Equations 77 Incorrect
35 DS More or Less 700 - 800 0:59 73:12 70:00 FDP Connections 75 Incorrect
36 PS Machine Tandem 600 - 700 0:49 74:01 72:00 Rates & Work 77 Correct
37 PS Purse Picking 600 - 700 0:56 74:57 74:00 Probability 75Incorrect

"I also look at the timing for the last five to ten problems in the section to see whether the person was rushing or had a lot of time left (meaning she rushed earlier in the section)." True with me
I spent more than 3 min on 8 Question in Quants. 8 "too slow" questions . I HAVE A TIMING PROBLEM . Iam doomed :( But if i don spend time how do i solve questions ?

VERBAL
On such killer thread i Encountered 9 Q in a line wrong with 2 correct in between.

19 SC Platinum and Gold 700 - 800 1:52 39:11 35:00 Comparisons 92 Correct
20 RC LCDs - Tone 700 - 800 2:40 41:51 39:00 Tone 88 Incorrect
21 RC LCDs - Except 700 - 800 1:05 42:56 40:00 Specific Detail 84 Incorrect
22 RC LCDs - Plasma 600 - 700 1:16 44:12 41:00 Specific Detail 86 Correct
23 CR Independent Films 700 - 800 2:09 46:21 43:00 Draw a Conclusion 82 Incorrect
24 SC Banana 600 - 700 2:31 48:52 44:30 Subject Verb Agreement 79 Incorrect
25 SC The Sparrow 600 - 700 1:43 50:35 46:00 Parallelism Comparisons 75 Incorrect
26 CR Basic Foods 700 - 800 2:04 52:39 48:00 Analyze Arg Structure 78 Correct
27 CR Alligators All Around 600 - 700 1:52 54:31 50:00 Weaken Conclusion 75 Incorrect
28 RC Dreams - Purpose 700 - 800 5:01 59:32 54:00 Main Idea 72 Incorrect
29 RC Dreams - LSD 700 - 800 0:44 60:16 55:00 Specific Detail 69 Incorrect
30 RC Dreams - Tone 500 - 600 0:13 60:29 56:00 Tone 66 Incorrect
31 SC Advertising Revenues600 - 700 1:05 61:34 57:30 Connecting Punctuation 68 Correct

6 RC 2 SC 3 CR Incorrect. I was sailing in easy 90 + % and then the killer wave struck me :( , an then could not rise up beyond 76 % . Slow Question : 2 q in sc with 2 + min but they were 700 + Q's.
RC took me down with it. Also in complete test I got 7 CR incorrect . I was able to solve 6 of them after the test while RC only 2 of 6 incorrect and SC only 1 of incorrect.

Assessment Report


Assessment Summary

Q Total Right Wrong Blank % Right Average
Time
RIGHT
Answers Average
Time
WRONG
Answers Average
Difficulty
RIGHT
Answers Average
Difficulty
WRONG
Answers
Problem Solving 22 12 10 0 55% 2:22 1:58 680 700
Data Sufficiency 15 6 9 0 40% 1:47 1:48 700 750

Sentence Correction 15 10 5 0 67% 1:19 2:05 710 710
Critical Reasoning 14 7 7 0 50% 1:53 1:55 680 690
Reading Comprehension 12 6 6 0 50% 2:18 1:47 680 700

Now the above report looks kinda almost on 50 % which buckets do i put them :(

[StaceyKoprince]

Okay, so your score might be somewhat inflated because you skipped the essays and took a longer break than allowed. No way to tell till you take your next test (under official conditions!) and see what happens.

The thing that's really jumping out at me for your first quant string: look at all that time you spent! 2:47, 3:04, 3:37, and 4:44 - 14m to get one question right! Can't keep doing that.

Just from those 4 Qs alone, you lost 6 minutes. You obviously also lost other time elsewhere, because then you ran out of time at the end - so that second string was caused by your earlier timing choices. In other words, all that extra time on the long ones didn't just cost you those - it also cost you all those questions at the end.

8 "too slow" questions . I HAVE A TIMING PROBLEM . Iam doomed :( But if i don spend time how do i solve questions ?

Yes, you do have a timing problem; no you are not doomed. :) Look at the data. On 4 long questions, above, you only got 1 right. What's the total right/wrong for those long ones? I'm guessing it's not so good. For the ones on which you spend extra time, your percentage should be at least as good as and ideally better than your general percentage. If that's not happening, stop wasting that time! Get them wrong faster. Literally.

Read this and do it:

http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2009/12/ ... management

Also, I think you would also benefit from a timing exercise: learning about how long one minute is without looking at a watch or stopwatch. If you don't have one already, buy yourself a stopwatch with lap timing capability. When you go to do a set of problems, start the stopwatch but turn it over so you can't see the time. Every time you think one minute has gone by, push the lap button. When you're done, see how good you were - and whether you tend to over or underestimate. Get yourself to the point where you're within 15 seconds either way on a regular basis (that is, you can generally predict between 45 sec and 1min 15 sec). Note: at the same time that you are using the stopwatch to time this "1-minute" thing, also use the OG Stopwatch (in your student center) to track the total time spent on each question.

Now, how do you use that when doing problems? If you're not on track by one minute*, make an educated guess** and move on. (The general idea is that if you're not on track by the halfway mark, you're unlikely to figure out what's holding you back AND have time to do the whole problem in the 1 min you have left.)

* For SC, 1min is well beyond the half-way mark (we're supposed to average about 1m15s here), but you can almost always eliminate at least some choices on SC in that timeframe. Once you've got that "I'm around the 1min mark and I'm struggling" feeling, go through any remaining choices ONCE more. Pick one. Move on.

** This also requires you to know HOW to make an educated guess depending upon the type of problem and the content being tested. So that's something else to add to your study: how to make educated guesses on different kinds of problems.

Verbal. Wow, you did that LCD passage way too quickly. That's a hard one! And RC dreams - the last two were also way too quick.

General rule: if you go way too quickly, you will make mistakes. If you go way too slowly, your percentage is probably not going to be good on those ones (you're going slowly, by definition, because you're struggling with the problems!) AND you're going to make mistakes on others because you'll then have to rush on others.

As I suspect you already know, you have to fix this timing problem. If you don't, it's unlikely that you'll hit 700+. If you do, then you have a shot!

We haven't even talked about specific content areas, which you can also learn about through that analysis, but I think you get the idea - now that you know what the data is, it's a lot easier to figure out what you need to fix!

[gitanshuoberoi]

Hi Stacey,

Gave CAT 4 today in full test conditions( with Essay and no extra break and scored 640 ( Q 47, V 31) wid essay

Previous scores

CAT 1 13 june 640 V 34 Q 43 without essay
CAT 2 27 June 640 V 34 Q 43 without essay
CAT 3 24 July 660 V 35 Q 45 without essay


Scored highest in quants so far but in Verbal got the lowest score so far. I got last 5 questions wrong in row in the end for verbal ( rushed I can say).Also for the first time go so many sc's wrong .SC had been always on high % in my verbal.

What I feel.

1. Math score may have increased because i was not pondering on questions . Guessing and moving ahead.

2. Verbal - I have not been practicing SC for a month now so may be scored low in SC this time. But I do not know why only less in sc this particular time.
Also the assesment report shows LOW Average difficulty for verbal , all ( CR,RC and SC). What went wrong with Verbal.

Basically score wise back to square one. next what should i do.? :(

Regards
GO

[StaceyKoprince]

Not back to square one, actually. Your other scores (without essays) were likely inflated somewhat. Now you know you can get that score even with the essays. That's something.

Use this article to evaluate your test thoroughly (just like you did last time). If you would like to share and discuss the results, please come back here and do so!
http://www.beatthegmat.com/a/2009/09/23 ... tice-tests

It's good that your quant increased; now we have to figure out why your verbal decreased - the analysis will help you figure that out.

[gitanshuoberoi]

HI Stacey,

After working on your tips, I gave CAT 5 yesterday. Scored 700 this time. Q 48 V 37.

Score chart so far -

CAT 1 13 June 640 V 34 Q 43
CAT 2 27 June 640 V 34 Q 43
CAT 3 24 July 660 V 35 Q 45
CAT 4 08 Aug 640 V 31 Q 47 wid AWA
CAT 5 29 Aug 700 V 37 Q 48 wid AWA

What tips I worked on, after your suggestions.

1. No pondering on questions. I only solved five questions with 3 min timing ( 4 correct - Quants.) verbal 2 - 3.

2. Timing was not much of a problem. I had 6 min left when i was on last question in math. Although I was almost running through out the test, trying to match the timing grid suggested in your blog ( both for Verbal and Quants).

BUT I have some doubts.

1. Although my score is higher than last time, the difficulty of questions ( both for Q and V ) was not as high as it was in last test ( in which I scored 660). I solved less 700's this time ( because computer threw less of 700's). Little confused why this happened. Is there some glitch in test which has inflated my score.
If you compare my analysis report from CAT 3 and CAT 5 this is somewhat apparent.

2. Can I schedue my GMAT in a months time . As stated in previous post, Iam looking for score around 680 ish .

3. What do I do next , improvements required. I still fell i need to work on Quants and verbal to solve tough questions.And timing which scares me always :)

4. Iam a bit spectical how the real test would be like as compared to MGAMT. Some say verbal score in MGAMT is inflated ! Do I need to raise it more to balance that fall.

Thanks in Advance
Regards
GO

[StaceyKoprince]

Good work! Yes, you should feel like you are "jogging" through the test, always pushing yourself to keep up. The better you're doing, the harder the mix of questions you get, and the harder it's going to be for you to keep to your pacing plan. That should be a good feeling, not a bad one, because you know you're doing well enough to keep getting hard questions! :)

Re: the question levels, take a look at the problem list. Did you completely stop getting 700+ questions at some point, for the rest of the section? Or is there still a mix?

Basically, before, you were spending extra time and getting some questions right that you really shouldn't have been getting right. That would push your score up at that point in the test, and you would get some harder questions, but then you'd run out of time and things would drop at the end, right? If you are working more steadily, though, then you won't go up as high in the middle, but you also won't drop so much at the end.

It's also possible that you "used up" the questions in your scoring range already, which can happen when someone scores at about the same level on all tests. But that would be a little bit less likely for you, especially on the verbal section (because you had more of a range of scores there).

[gitanshuoberoi]

Hi Stacey,

Thx again for your view on the level of questions thrown by the test. I think you are right.

Can you also throw some light on other set of queries I have please !

2. Can I schedue my GMAT in a months time . As stated in previous post, Iam looking for score around 680 ish .

3. What do I do next , improvements required. I still fell i need to work on Quants and verbal to solve tough questions.And timing which scares me always :)

4. Iam a bit spectical how the real test would be like as compared to MGAMT. Some say verbal score in MGAMT is inflated ! Do I need to raise it more to balance that fall.

Thanks in advance and sorry for troubling.

Regards
GO

[gitanshuoberoi]

Hi Stacey,

I gave a GMATprep yesterday and scored 640 :( Q 47 V 31)

I felt Quant was tougher than MGMAT.

Verbal . I got 10 SC incorrect !!! Concidering my SC accuracy has been always around 70 % in MGMAT. Don know what killed me.

Disappointed !

However i just took my GMAT date - 24 oct . Please guide what should be my strategy.
Regards
GO

[StaceyKoprince]

As a general rule, people do not consistently score a lot higher or lower on the real test - that is, it isn't the case that everyone's verbal score drops on the real test. Some people do have a drop. Some don't. Some actually increase! That's just the nature of a standardized test with a decently wide standard deviation. (The SD on the official test is about 30 points; on our test, it's about 50 points.)

640 is good - you want a 680, so you're getting there. Did you do it with AWA? Did you take it under official conditions?

On SC, go back over every question carefully; use this article to help:

http://www.beatthegmat.com/a/2009/10/09 ... ce-problem

Where you made mistakes, ask yourself WHY. Use this article to help:
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/04/ ... our-errors

That general kind of analysis in the two articles above is what you should be doing (for questions that you get right or wrong, for areas of strength or weakness).

I still fell i need to work on Quants and verbal to solve tough questions.

Be careful about this. You won't be offered the harder questions unless you can answer the "next level down" questions pretty effectively. And you won't have time to do much with the harder questions if you can't answer the "next level down" questions efficiently. If you want to score in the 80th percentile in a section, for example, you can get all of the questions above 80th wrong, and you can even get some in the 70s wrong, but if you start getting too many wrong in the 60s or lower, then you're not going to get that 80th percentile score. Whatever level you're at, you'll be offered some questions that are harder than that level. It's okay to get a lot of those wrong.

And timing which scares me always :)

Yes, timing is a big deal. :) Keep working on it! (For others reading this, look up above at our earlier conversation where we discussed timing, if you want more.)

[gitanshuoberoi]

HI Stacey,
I Love you !

I gave GMAT this weekend and scored 700 ( Q 48 V 36). I would like to thank you for making me hit the nail rightly. Your tips really helped me to tighten loose points . The constant motivation that i seeked from your replies helped me to overcome the stress.
I would like to mentions some points ,which helped me to pull my score and stamina . I learned all this from you.
1. Always give tests in real condition.
2. Dump ur Quants ego behind while answering questions. The moment I applied this strategy my Quants score was pulled from 43 - 44 to 47 - 48.
3. The timing chart is simply awesome. I followed it though out my test CATs and GMAT . Moreover I took an extra booklet to make a display next to my monitor :)
For fellow students who dont know this timing chart , here is the timing chart.
Quants : Around 7 - 8 questions need to be completed every 15 mins. Follow the below chart to be on time throughout the test. If you loose track you are out. Its very difficult to pace up in ending ( without making silly - lilly mistakes)
75 Min - 1 Question
60 - 7 - 8
45 - 14 - 15
30 - 21 - 22
15 - 28 - 29
Verbal . Around 8 to 9 questions every 15 mins.
75 Min - 1 Question
60 - 8 - 9
45 - 16 - 17
30 - 24 - 25
15 - 32 - 35
Also, I would like to thank Ron And Tim who's verbal explanations were like words of GOD :). One thing which always used to make me laugh, while going through the verbal explanation was, when you guys scolded poor students, who questioned GMAT correct questions, by saying " DO NOT QUESTION GMAT CORRECT ANSWERS ". :)

PN : M sure I have made loads of verbal mistakes in above write up. Please omit because I never ever question GMAT correct answers :)

Well, now the score is here. How to move ahead ? which direction, self evaluation and loads of question. Can i get some help on this as well from you guys.
Thanks a lot .
Gitanshu

[StaceyKoprince]

HI Stacey,
I Love you !

lol! Great job!!! I'm really happy for you.

And, yes, I can hear Ron in particular saying "Don't question official answers - just understand why!"

Re: your last question about moving ahead, are you referring to applications? I'd love to help, but I'm not an admissions expert. :)

I would suggest that you talk to some admissions experts - you can ask questions here on our forum in the Ask an Admissions Expert folder. If you're one of our students, you can also sign up for a free 30 minute consultation with MBAMission. (Full disclosure: we do have a financial arrangement with that company. But I'm not advising you to spend money - just take advantage of the free offer. :)