Need advice (second opinion) for being on the fence

[ronaldramlan]

Hello,

Prior to writing this post, I have read some other posts, especially about those written by fellow students looking for improvements. I know that my case is probably cliche for which many have probably asked. Yet, I'd still like to write it down so that I can personally have your advice rather than second guess on what would be your response to my problem as to other students' similar problems.

I took my first GMAT test in Dec 2008 and scored 660 (50Q, 29V). Before I took the test, I had enrolled to a 33-hour private tutoring from a leading test prep company (I'd rather not mention the name). There was nothing unusual on my test day, except that I missed at least 3 minutes on Verbal section because the administrator didn't key in the password in time as soon as the break period between Quant and Verbal ended. I was nervous going through the Verbal section, but still chose to report the exam. At that moment, I knew that I should retake the test.

With a strong motivation to improve my score, I took another preparation course, this time an online one, starting at the beginning of 2010. I also purchased a Manhattan SC Guide, a purchase that allowed me to have access to your student centre with 5 repeatable CAT simulation tests. I have completed all the tests, and I'd be more than happy if you can have a look at the assessment results. As far as I remember, I didn't take the AWA when taking each of the CATs, so you may point that I probably had my score inflated as you did in other posts. Although I consider it reasonable, I still find it arguable as, in the real test, people take a break between AWA and Quant, a sufficient time to reset the mental exertion. In this case, whether or not someone takes AWA prior to taking Quant, his/her mental state is unlikely to be different.

Having studied for almost a year (my work responsibilities were so demanding that I only had spare time during the weekends to study), I finally took the second test a couple of days ago and scored exactly the same score (660) as I did before, only with different composition (49Q, 30V).

I was shocked since I believed that I had done well on many CATs - including those 5 CATs in your student centre - I took during my preparation. Even though all practice CATs I took were probably inflated by 30 to 40 pts, at least a 710 should have been attainable.

On the other hand, it also crossed my mind that I had probably reached my limit, that no matter how much I prepared, I was not going to be able to raise the bar. But then I realized that I once read in a forum that one can take as many GMAT tests as one wants, and most top schools only consider the highest score. Thus, I start questioning my earlier judgement as I would have nothing to lose by taking another test.

If I were true about the latter, I would still end up with another issue "how else am I going prepare that I could actually break the 700 barrier this time?"
I have tried so many CATs from GMAT Prep, your CATs, and many others from both my former and online test prep companies.
In addition, I have a strong feeling, accumulated from both my experiences with actual GMAT test, that the questions from actual test, especially verbal, are somehow "different" from the ones in many CAT tests I have taken so far.

They are particularly different in a way that, for instance, SC questions, unlike those from simulation tests, contain answers that cannot be immediately distinguished from other answer choices. That's why I feel that I spent more time even for SC - the easiest in verbal section -, though managed to answer all questions, in the actual GMAT than in any of my CAT tests. The same also applies to CR and RC. Such feeling makes me wonder whether a preparation course can really help me. Having said so, I have NO intention to undermine any GMAT preparation courses.

Here are the CATs I took during my preparation.
Note : XXX/YYY = CATs from online test prep companies

GMAT Prep Practice Test 1 47Q, 40V 700 Jan 9, 2010
GMAT Prep Practice Test 2 50Q, 34V 700 Jan 24, 2010
XXX Test #1 50Q, 32V 690 Feb 14, 2010
YYY Test #1 50Q 38V 690 May 30, 2010
Manhattan CAT #1 42Q 39V 670 Jul 3, 2010
Manhattan CAT #2 47Q 41V 720 Aug 6, 2010
Manhattan CAT #3 51Q 40V 740 Aug 15, 2010
Manhattan CAT #4 50Q 36V 710 Aug 21, 2010
Manhattan CAT #5 51Q 45V 780 Aug 28, 2010
XXX Test #2 51Q 35V 710 Sep 4, 2010
YYY Test #2 51Q 38V 700 Sep 10, 2010
XXX Test #3 49Q 37V 710 Oct 2, 2010
YYY Test #4 51Q 35V 680 Dec 27, 2010
XXX Test #4 48Q 30V 690 Dec 31, 2010
YYY Test #5 47Q 40V 710 Jan 3, 2010

Now, into my dilemma.

1. Do you think that I should retake another test? Or, should I stop playing around with GMAT just focus on searching for and applying to schools in which my score falls into their average GMAT?
2. If you think I should retake, how else should I prepare as I believe that I have already known most of the concepts to attack GMAT questions?
If you think that I seem to fail not on knowing the concepts but on putting them into practice, haven’t I already had enough practice?

Again, you can have a look at my Manhattan CAT results and assessments to confirm the above scores.

Your feedback would be highly appreciated!

Regards,
Ronald

[StaceyKoprince]

No need to apologize for wanting to ask about your specific case; we're here to look into each case individually!

I have completed all the tests, and I'd be more than happy if you can have a look at the assessment results.

We can help you assess the results, but we won't actually do the analysis for you. :) That's something you need to be able to do yourself. Do the analysis described in this article:

http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/e ... -part1.cfm

Then come back here and post your analysis - NOT just the data, but your analysis of what the data means. We'll tell you whether we agree with your assessment of things (and if not, why not) and we'll help you figure out what to do.

Although I consider it reasonable, I still find it arguable as, in the real test, people take a break between AWA and Quant, a sufficient time to reset the mental exertion. In this case, whether or not someone takes AWA prior to taking Quant, his/her mental state is unlikely to be different.

I respectfully disagree and I have lots of data to back it up (though I can't share it because it's student test data. :) It's definitely true that some people don't experience a score drop when taking a test with the essays after having skipped the essays on all or most of the practice tests. Many people, though, do. Whether it affects you - I don't know. But after writing essays for an hour, you need a minimum of another hour to get back to "zero" (in terms of lowering the mental fatigue dial); 8 min isn't going to cut it. The vast majority of people are going to be more mentally fatigued at the start of the quant section after they've written essays for an hour than if they can just start the quant section straight away.

I have tried so many CATs from GMAT Prep, your CATs, and many others from both my former and online test prep companies.

CAT exams are really good for (a) figuring out where you're scoring right now, (b) practicing stamina, and (c) analyzing your strengths and weaknesses. The actual act of just taking the exam is NOT so useful for improving. It's what you do with the test results / between tests that helps you to improve. From the way you've described your prep, it sounds like you were focused more on doing a bunch of problems rather than analyzing and learning from those problems - which only happens after you've done the problems in the first place. There's a huge difference. We typically need to spend 2x to 5x as long reviewing a problem as doing it in the first place, and sometimes longer.

The kind of study described in these articles is what really helps you to learn:

http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/a ... roblem.cfm
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/error-log.cfm
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/09/ ... t-problems
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2009/12/ ... management

And for more on analyzing problems:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/GMATprep-SC.cfm
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/CR-assumption.cfm
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/a ... estion.cfm
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/a ... roblem.cfm
http://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/a ... roblem.cfm

In terms of whether to take the test again, there are multiple factors to consider. I actually just wrote a couple of articles about this topic - take a look here:

http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/12/ ... how-part-1
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/12/ ... how-part-2

Take a look at those, consider your situation, and if you have additional questions or want to discuss, feel free to come back here to post. You may also want to post in our Ask An Admissions Consultant folder.

If you then decide to retake the test and you want to talk more about HOW, start with the articles above and come on back for more when you're ready. (And, obviously, let us know if you have any questions.)

Good luck with everything!

[ronaldramlan]

I decided to build my analysis based on the assessment of CAT #1 and CAT #4 as both have the least scores, 670 and 710 each. Here is my analysis.

CAT #1 (670)
Quantitative
In term of timing, I had a problem with spending slightly more time than the average 2 mins per question. The timing gap grew even larger from the middle to the end of quant section. Out of the questions categorized as "too slow", DS turns out to be the main problem as I got more than half the questions wrong. At the same time, I also frequently got rather difficult questions (700-800), which probably dragged me down. Most of the "too fast" questions occurred on questions near to the end of the section, many of which I got wrong too. In term of subject category, geometry and FDP are areas for improvement.
Verbal
My problem of timing continued to the verbal section, and my "too slow" group is dominated by CR questions with mixed difficulties, but I got them correct. It appears that the extended time was well spent. On the opposite side, my "too fast" group consists of mainly SC questions for which I was correct. What’s interesting is that I got many CR questions, which were answered in time, wrong. Perhaps, this is the collateral of the "too slow" questions. In addition, the percentage of CR questions correctly answered is comparably low with either RC or SC. Bottom line, SC is my strength, while CR, especially assumption, strengthen/weaken and evaluate argument, is my nightmare. RC, on the other hand, tends to be on a borderline as I got most of RC correct in timely manner, but those are relatively easy/medium level questions.

CAT #4 (710)
Quantitative
I was able to deal with my timing problem. Moreover, I also managed to overcome my problem with DS. I got all questions classified as "too fast" and most of the "too slow" questions correct. In general, I would say that I was okay with quantitative.
Verbal
I could also overcome my problem with timing. Although I managed to get all CR questions in the category of "too slow" questions correct, I suffered so much in the rest of CR questions that were answered in time. It appears that my problem with CR became worse. Fortunately, I successfully improved my hit rate on RC, even though I seemed to get less difficult RC questions. In addition, I was able to maintain my accuracy and to improve my timing on SC. In sum, CR remains to be my weakest area, although I should not underestimate RC.

Despite the above analysis, I have long identified that CR and RC are my weakest area for which I need to spend more time on, and that SC should be my ultimate weapon to produce the spare time. However, as I said in my earlier post, I feel that the SC questions in real GMAT test are different from the ones I have seen in many other simulated CAT tests. In fact, all verbal questions seem to be more difficult as I was often stunned since my POE resulted in all answer choices crossed out. Unlike those in simulated CAT tests, SC questions in real GMAT test hide the errors being tested so well that I cannot quickly identify them. As a result, I was unable to spare sufficient time to offset the additional time spent on CR and RC. Sometimes I think that I was probably so carried away with the stereotype of so many verbal questions I took during my preparation that I could not quickly see the different patterns/styles appeared during my actual GMAT.
Fortunately, I find the quantitative questions relatively comparable to what I have learned so far.

Now, going to your response to my questions about whether I should spend time preparing and taking the test again, I have read the articles you alluded to, and I’m particularly interested in a section that discusses "Why I don’t want to retake the test?". While I do have other areas, particularly extracurricular or volunteer activities, that I need to improve, I also possess a strong professional experience and undergraduate academic record. So far to my knowledge, and perhaps I should have consulted this with an admission consultant, the key areas seen when selecting an applicant are undergraduate record (GPA), GMAT and professional experience. It is not to say that extracurricular activities are irrelevant, but they bear less consideration. Coming back to my situation, I have 2 holes that I need to fill in, GMAT or extracurricular experience. I know that I would be better off filling in the former, yet I also need to measure my chance of improving my GMAT score. This is why sometimes I think that an admission consultant or a GMAT instructor alone won’t be able to provide a comprehensive answer to a question about whether or not to retake, especially when coupled with an attempt to improve other areas considered in the admission process. Therefore, I believe that we need to address each issue individually. The fact that I have started this post suggests that I need help to as much as possible measure my chance of improving my score, leaving alone other aspects for the moment. Once I could identify my chance, regardless of the outcome, I will then be able to confidently move on.

[StaceyKoprince]

CAT 1:

It appears that the extended time was well spent.

(You said that about CR.) Maybe. Maybe not. You can't answer that just based upon whether you got the questions right. You also have to figure out whether they cost you elsewhere.

When reviewing the test questions, did you ever look at something and think, "I can't believe I got that wrong! I should have had that!"? How many times did that happen? WHY did you get it wrong? Was timing AT ALL a factor? What was the difficulty level?

If you spend extra time to get one 700-800 level Q right but that then causes you to get a sub-600 level question wrong - you just hurt yourself more than you helped yourself. It's worse to get lower-level Qs wrong.

So. Dig in a little more and see whether you still feel that the extra time was well spent. :)

Cat 4: you talk about how you overcame your timing problem because you got the "too slow" Qs mostly right and it didn't hurt you too much on the "too fast" Qs. That's not actually indicative of overcoming your timing problem. Overcoming your timing problem means that you have zero to three questions in the entire section that are too slow, and they're too slow by maybe an extra 15 to 30 seconds, not by minutes. You can NEVER anticipate when you might make a careless mistake, but you CAN anticipate that you will make more careless mistakes when you're rushing. And you will have to rush at some point if you continue to spend too much time on some Qs.

Okay, your big question here is about your opportunity for improvement. Your quant score is already almost maxed out, so this is really about your capacity for improvement on verbal.

Unlike those in simulated CAT tests, SC questions in real GMAT test hide the errors being tested so well that I cannot quickly identify them.

You're on to something here, but it isn't exactly what you think. Every test-writer has a certain "signature" in terms of the way they use language and construct questions, and those signatures are more distinct on verbal than on quant. You have learned to read the MGMAT signatures, but you are struggling to read the real-test-writer signatures. That's good news and bad news. The good news is that you learned to do it for one set of tests. The bad news is that there is less practice material available that comes directly from the real test writers - but that's what you'd need to do in order to learn to recognize the real test questions better.

You can use OG and GMATPrep for that (taking GMATPrep repeatedly just to extract all of the questions, and even taking screen shots to make a set of drills for yourself).

In terms of how much you can improve, I don't have an answer to that question. Nobody can give you anything resembling a precise answer, unfortunately - it's one of those things where there's a risk and you're going to have to gamble a bit here. You did score higher on both GMATPrep tests in verbal, and you took those about a year ago, so you might want to re-download the software (to get the updated Q database) and try again under 100% official conditions. Possibly part of the problem on the real test day was nerves / anxiety and possibly you would be able to learn how to deal with those things and raise your score to GMATPrep levels (lower score was 34 on verbal for you).

I would also, if I were you, talk to an admissions consultant about the strengths and weaknesses of the rest of your application. see what the consultant thinks are your particular weaknesses and see how important the consultant thinks those things are. If they aren't very important, then yeah, spend your time on the GMAT. If the consultant thinks there's a hole in a very important area, though, then you have a tougher decision...