I need urgently helps.

[StaceyKoprince]

you're welcome! good luck!

[shimbal80]

Dear Stacey,
I have really problem in verbal.
I applied your all advices and guides. Also, I studied Manhattan strategy guide in verbal (SC, CR, RC). finally I took first Manhattan and got 650 (Q47, V32) in real condition GMATtest. I was really happy. because I can improve my verbal score from 19 to 32. Specially, I improved my SC . I got 70% correct in 700-800 level. But in CR , I had problem specially in draw conclusion.

Critical Reasoning 14 6 8 0 43%
300 - 500 1 0 1 0%
500 - 600 3 2 1 67%
600 - 700 5 3 2 60%
700 - 800 5 1 4 20%

I worked and studied more in my weakness area, then after 20 days, I took the second manhattan test, and got 600 (Q47, V27) in real condition GMAT test.
I have the same problem, I can not improve my CR. I answered all draw conclusion wrong. I do not understand why?
when I practice ,I can answer right 70%, and I realized why.

Could you help me and give me some advice for improving my CR?
I can improve my SC by using your strategy. I really appreciate you. because my Verbal score in real test was 19. and now I can increase my SC to 70% in 700-800 level. But I still have problem in CR.

I am really frustrated, I want to take the real GMAT for third time in 2 months, I do not want to get lower score.
My target score is 650.
Do you think it is good idea that I get tutor for 4 hours (4 hours because I can not afford the costs) if I can not get high score (650) in third Manhattan gmat? (I will take the third Manhattan Gmat test 2 weeks later, after I review and study in my weakness) and also if I want get 650 in real test, how much should I get in practice Manhattan Gmat test?

I am looking forward to hearing from you.
Thanks in advance

[StaceyKoprince]

I'm really happy for you on your SC progress - nice work!

Part of what you need to learn is how to review your own work and figure out why you got something wrong, etc. We can help you with that on the forums, or you can also meet with a tutor. (It's more efficient, but also more expensive, to meet with a tutor.)

I suggest that you begin by searching (on the forums) for the problems that you got wrong. See if they're already posted and, if so, read the discussion. If you have additional questions, then post them in that existing thread for that problem. If you don't find the problem, post it yourself (make sure to read and follow the forum guidelines when posting).

These are the things you want to keep in mind when first reviewing a problem that you got wrong:

- why did I think the wrong answer was right? what, specifically, made it seem correct?
- why is the wrong answer actually wrong?
- why did I think the right answer was wrong? what, specifically, made it seem wrong?
- why is the right answer actually right? (lots of times, your best response to this might be simply: it's the least bad of the 5 answers)

For the 1st and 3rd bullets above, you then need to add these to a list: this is a bad reason to choose something (because I used this reasoning to choose a wrong answer), and this is a bad reason to eliminate something (because I used this reasoning to eliminate a right answer).

You can do the above kind of work with a tutor or on the forums. It will take longer on the forums and there may be some things that get "lost in translation" because you are not communicating in real-time with the teacher, but it's also free. Working with a tutor is much more expensive.

Read this article to learn more about the best way to learn from the forums, even if you decide to work with a tutor:
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/05/ ... the-forums

You might consider trying yourself for a week or two and then, if you don't think you're making enough progress, you can revisit the idea of a tutor. I should let you know that, at this time of year, it can take a while to get a tutor. Certain markets already have waiting lists (I think the waiting list for MGMAT in NY is 1 month right now).

Re: practice test scores, you would want to be scoring at least 650 under full official conditions (including essays). It's nice to be scoring a bit higher than your goal, just to give yourself some extra "buffer" room.

[shimbal80]

Dear Stacey,

I always appreciate you for guiding and helping students and I introduce Manhattan as the best source and tutors to my friends who want to take GMAT.

I will take GMAT for the third time on 29th of October (in 10 days).
I took 5 Manhattan exams in the full official condition including essays. My verbal score is consistent on 31, and my math score is 44-47. My average score is 630.
I took 2 official guide :
Q 49, V 27, 640 (2 month ago)
Q 49, V 25, 610 (2 weeks ago)

My goal score is 600. Do you think I can reach my goal score? or I should postpone my schedule? I need 600.

Also, my problem in verbal section is timing. therefore when I am behind of the right time, I sacrifice some question in my weakness area. My weakness area is reading comprehension, so I guess educated and move on when I am behind of time. Is it good strategy? or I should change my strategy?

the last question, Could you please advise me what should do in the last 10 days for taking the official GMAT? and aslo I have one Manhattan cat (6th) that I will take on this Friday.

Thanks in advance,
sh

[StaceyKoprince]

You are in the range that you want to score, yes, so you do have a shot at the 600. There are a lot of factors that go into test day, so there isn't a way to say that you will definitely hit 600, but you are in range. (If you weren't, I would tell you!)

In terms of whether to take it now or take a little more time, you're going to have to make that call. You could work a bit longer to raise your practice test scores a little more, making it more likely that you will hit 600 on the real test - but that will take more time and, possibly, you don't even need to do that (because you might get the score now). Alternatively, you could take it as planned, with the mindset that you will take it again if you don't hit the 600.

I would personally be inclined to take it as planned - after all, no matter when I take it, it's always the case that I would have to take it again if I don't get my 600. The risk doesn't completely go away if I take a bit longer. I think this is very much a personal choice, though - some people would feel more comfortable making the opposite decision - so you're going to have to decide for yourself.

Re: timing, yes, you are sometimes going to have to sacrifice problems. The ideal ones to sacrifice are the hardest ones of ANY type. When you see something that you're really not sure you can do, or it might take you twice as long as normal to do - give those up. And give them up as you see them, not just when you're behind. You're going to get about 40% of the questions wrong anyway, so it's totally okay to let those go.

Ditto for your weaker areas - give them up when they are too hard, but don't give up on all of them. There are still some RCs that you CAN do, right? :) The threshold for giving up on RC is lower, because the areas is weaker for you, but there are still times you want to give up on even harder questions in your stronger areas.

If you follow the above, that will help you not to get too far behind at any point, so that you can make a question-based decision as to whether you think you can do something; you won't have to randomly give up something that you might have been able to do, just because you're behind on time.

For the last two weeks, use these two articles:
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/08/ ... -game-plan
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/08/ ... -to-review

Also, this RC stuff might be helpful for you:
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/04/ ... mp-passage
http://www.beatthegmat.com/mba/2010/07/ ... rc-passage

(I have more if you decide to take more time, but if you stick with the 10 days, just use the above. Let me know what you decide!)

[shimashouri]

Good conversation in this topic!!!

[shimbal80]

Dear Stacey,

Unfortunately, I took GMAT for the third time and got 560. (Q 49, V19). I did not have stress.
The math was so difficult but my score is good. In verbal, 70% of critical reasoning were evaluating questions. No conclusion questions, No infer questions, 1 assumptions and 1 strengthening, 1 weakening. It was weird.


I can not believe. I am shocked. I studied for 4 months as you advised and My scores in manahattan test are as following: (All of them were took under official condition).

Man 1 on 31st July: 650 (Q 47, V 32)
Man 2 on 19th august: 600 (Q 47, V 27)
Official GMATprep on 29th august: 640 (Q 49, V 27)
Man 3 on 13rd September: 600 (Q 44, V 30)
Man 4 on 26th september: 600 (Q 43, V 31)
Official GMATprep on 10th October: 610 (Q 49, V 25)
Man 5 on 16th October: 630 (Q 46, V 31)
Man 6 on 24th October: 680 (Q 48, V 35)

In all above tests, I analysed them, checked the answer and noted all strategy as you advise me. I think I know all of them.
and also, in all of them, my average of SC score was 650 (52% right). my average of CR score was 630 (63% right). my average of RC was 600 (36% right). But I did not work well on RC.

Now, I got 560 (Q 49, V 19) in official test. It is unbelievable. It is the third time. I am frustrated. I do not know what to do.
I need 600.
My first attempt was 480 (Q 47, V 12). and my second attempt was 530 (Q 46, V 19) . Now, my verbal score is the same as second attempt's. I can not believe.

Please help me what should do. I want to register for fourth time next month on 29th November. I can not wait , I want to prove that I can. but I run out my materials. I know all official tests and I took manhattan tests for second time. I remember all of them. I do not know why I got this score.

I read your article "My Score Dropped! Figuring Out What Went Wrong" and I just found that my problem may be timing. In Manhattan test I also had this problem but my scores were not bad.

Stacey, please advise me.

1- I am thinking to get private tutor for 5 hours (I can not afford more) but I think 5 hours is not enough. what is your opinion?
2- Do you think I should get private tutor for 10 hours? or I should register for manhattan class?
3- Do you think one month is enough to take the test again. I think I am ready. I know all materials. I am afraid of forgetting the materials.
4- Which material do you advise me? are there other materials to work on? Do you think I should take 800 scores tests (but I took the free 1 test for math and I think it can not compare with manhattan test, it is not strong) or I should use kaplan quiz bank? or beat the gmat practice questions?
5- my weakness area is reading comprehension. Do you think in 1 month I should work more on it? I do not have problem in MAth. what is your advice for improving my RC?
6- I am not native, Do you think, this is my problem?

I am looking forward to hearing from you.

Thanks in advance,
Sh

[StaceyKoprince]

I'm sorry that you had a disappointing experience on test day. The most important thing right now is to try to figure out why this happened.

I do want to point out that you have made steady progress on each of your official tests (even though you haven't gotten to the level that you want) so you should still feel good about that!

There are two broad scenarios:
(1) your practice test scores are indicative of your ability level, but your level dropped for some reason on test day
(2) your practice test scores were inflated for some artificial reason; they were not indicative of your level, and so the real test showed your real level more clearly.

I read your article "My Score Dropped! Figuring Out What Went Wrong" and I just found that my problem may be timing. In Manhattan test I also had this problem but my scores were not bad.

We're going to need a lot more information on this. What timing problems did you have, in as much detail as possible? What can you find out from your practice tests that might shed some light on timing problems on the real test? (Note: timing problems often get exacerbated on the real test, due to the pressure.)

Depending upon the magnitude of the timing problem, that alone could explain a large score drop.

You mentioned that you took the practice tests for the second time. When you saw questions you'd seen before, how did you handle them? Did you make sure to take full time on every one? Did you get them wrong again if you'd gotten them wrong the first time? If you got them all right or if you took less than full time, then your practice test scores may have been inflated.

For CR, can you explain what you mean by "evaluating" questions? (Don't attempt to recreate any actual question text from the real test.) Also, just FYI, you said that you didn't see any "infer" questions on CR - infer questions are on RC, not CR. Draw a conclusion questions on CR are the functional equivalent of infer questions on RC. Most people see 1 or 2 DC questions on CR.

Did you see fill-in-the-blank CR questions? I ask because any CR question type can be written with a fill-in-the-blank structure, and that structure often looks different than what we're used to, so people often have trouble recognizing the question type when it is in fill-in-the-blank format.

Re: tutoring or taking a class, first I have to say that I have an obvious conflict of interest in advising you on possibly spending more money with my company. I'll advise you to the best of my ability as a teacher, but I do have to give that disclaimer.

You could get something out of tutoring if you want to take the test in about 3.5 weeks, but a class probably isn't the best bet. Most classes run much longer than that, and the "compressed" classes are probably not the best option for you, given that you want to concentrate solely on verbal.

You can get quite a bit out of 5 hours of tutoring as long as you're using the tutoring wisely. You don't want the tutoring to be a bunch of "homework help" - where the teacher just tells you how to do a bunch of problems, one after the other. It'd be better for the teacher to review your recent tests and also observe your thinking / approach on different kinds of problems so that s/he can best advise you. You might bring certain problems with you that are giving you trouble or that "feel" like what you struggled with on the real test. Then you explain to the teacher what you think and how you tried to do them. Your current knowledge and thought process will then help the teacher figure out what you need to learn and practice in order to get better.

Then, depending upon how the teacher diagnoses you, s/he will teach you and advise you about what to do outside of your sessions.

[shimbal80]

Dear Stacey,

Thank you very much for replying my answers.

There are two broad scenarios:
(1) your practice test scores are indicative of your ability level, but your level dropped for some reason on test day
(2) your practice test scores were inflated for some artificial reason; they were not indicative of your level, and so the real test showed your real level more clearly.

I checked my past practice tests and I found that the first scenario is more probable than second one. It is true that I took these practice tests for second time but I did not remember the questions and answers, so I spent the real time on questions. But for the last practice test that I got 680, I was a little lucky because I guessed 2 RC randomly but the answers were correct. Just I can say for the last exam that my score was inflated. In all tests, I figure out that when I answered CR and SC correctly, I understood them why these answers were right and why I chose these questions right.

We're going to need a lot more information on this. What timing problems did you have, in as much detail as possible? What can you find out from your practice tests that might shed some light on timing problems on the real test? (Note: timing problems often get exacerbated on the real test, due to the pressure.)

I think about my last real exam and your article, I found that on the real test, my time run out for 3 last questions and I answered randomly. Also, I answered 2 last RCs randomly with out thinking about them but I waste my time because I tried to understand the reading but I could not concentrate. I had stress and answered completely randomly. Therefore, I waste both my time and my questions as incorrect. I checked the time every 15 min but I lose my concentration. I think the last 10 questions hurts my score.

For CR, can you explain what you mean by "evaluating" questions? (Don't attempt to recreate any actual question text from the real test.) Also, just FYI, you said that you didn't see any "infer" questions on CR - infer questions are on RC, not CR. Draw a conclusion questions on CR are the functional equivalent of infer questions on RC. Most people see 1 or 2 DC questions on CR.

I mean the majority of questions like "which answers can evaluate the conclusion or argument?" or " which answers can explain the discrepancy" .
Also, regarding infer questions, I mean draw conclusion. I never saw the draw conclusion for CR. But I saw 1 fill-in-the-blank questions in the last minute that I had to guess randomly.

after 4 days that I think about my timing problem, I find that I need a strategy for timing. because I answered some CR longer than 2 minutes. Here is my strategy:
I divide the verbal to 4 sections, each has 10 questions (I know like 15 minutes sections). I should try to answer the first sections completely with out sacrifice RC (because before when I saw I am behind of my time, I sacrificed completely my RC as weakness area). You mentioned in your articles that I prevent to sacrifice the whole RC because doing so causes the 3 or 4 incorrect questions in raw that hurts my score. Then, I should try to answer some questions in RCs like main purpose in 2 the next sections and answered the rest in RC randomly. I think doing so helps to compensate my time in order to have 20 minutes for the last section (last 11 questions) to answer carefully and also answer last RC completely. I found that the first 10-15 questions and the last 10 questions are important. Is it correct?

1-Do you think this strategy is good? and help me to reach my goal?
I should mention that I need just 600.

2- Also I want to reset the practice test, and take them again with new strategy but I think there are many questions that I saw, what should I do? Do you think doing so helps me? is it enough? are other tests available?
In addition, I want to make some midtest (20 questions) mixed SC, CR and RC to practice for timing and my strategy form official guid. Does it help me?

3- For the last thing, I think I have the knowledge so the tutor for this matter, can not help me (my goal is 600). I should practice in timing and the strategy. Do you agree with me? what is your opinion?

I apologize for long posting but I need your advice and help.
I really appreciate you for answering and helping students.

Thanks in advance,
sh

[StaceyKoprince]

Okay, so you definitely had timing problems on the real test. If, in a complete worst-case scenario, you answered the last 10 questions incorrectly, that could result in a 20+ percentile point drop in your score (depends on many things, including how many of the Qs were experimental). So, yes, we definitely need to fix that.

In fact, if you can fix the timing problem alone, that should be enough to get you to your desired 600 - you're only 40 points short right now.

In terms of how to handle that timing, the plan that you presented to me is still falling a bit short. Don't assume that certain questions are more or less important based solely on their position in the test - the earlier questions or the later questions aren't more important than questions anywhere on the test.

Your goal is to deal with the questions that you can deal with in the expected timeframe and to recognize when you can't (either you can't do it at all or you can't do it in the expected timeframe). And, when you can't, you want to be able to make a decent guess, again without going over the expected timeframe.

SC questions should average about 1m15s to 1m20s. CR should average about 2m. RC should average about 2-3m for the read-through, about 1m for general questions, and 1.5 to 2m for specific questions. Don't go 30s over the average on any single question in the section. Really - spending that extra time doesn't help.

You're going to have to guess sometimes - everybody does. Give yourself a shot at every question - after all, there will be some RC that you can get right. Guess based on what you actually see that you're struggling to do - the ones on which, after 30 to 60 seconds of trying, you're thinking "What?!?" Cut those off faster. (30 to 60s. NOT 10s; you can't make great decisions after only 10s.)

Use this process for all verbal Qs:
1st pass through answers: place answers into 1 of 2 categories, definitely wrong or maybe. DO NOT decide whether something is right (until you have looked at each choice at least once).

2nd pass through: look only at the "maybe" answers, look more closely, choose one. When you are down to two answers on verbal, look at each answer ONCE more, then pick one and move on.

If you get stuck on the 2nd pass, you've already narrowed down; just pick something that remains. If you get stuck on the 1st pass (doesn't happen often, but can happen), you know this is one of those ones on which you should just bail!

It is a great idea to make mixed sets of Qs for yourself from OG. Use the timing guidelines I gave you above to set a time limit. And only do 3 or 4 questions per RC passage - don't do them all!

Re: practice tests, yes, if you remember lots of the questions, that's problematic. If you still have GMATPrep, you can use those. Otherwise, you'll have to look for other sources. We've got a deal for our students with 800Score - you can get a discount on their tests. The other big companies also have good tests (lots of money for research!).

Re: tutoring, a tutor can help you with anything, including timing and strategy. You can also work on your own, as many people do. I can't make a specific recommendation because I have a conflict of interest - I'll just say that, if you're worried about a tutor not being able to help you with these things - a good tutor can still help with these things.

You aren't that far from your goal and I do think that if you can fix the timing problem, you have a much better shot at hitting the 600. You've also taken the test multiple times already, though, so possibly you might want to get some extra help. It isn't an obvious call either way - it's up to you.

[shimbal80]

Dear Stacey,

I do not know how to appreciate you. Thank you very much. your advice really helps me.

Shima

Ps. Do you think 1 month is enough for me to reach my goal? I am worried to forget the notes in long time.

[StaceyKoprince]

I would say that most people need about 4 to 6 weeks to fix timing problems, though some people take less time and some take more. Aim for 4 weeks, but check your progress as you go along. If, by week 3, you haven't gotten substantially better with timing, then give yourself more time.