Study and Strategy questions relating to the GMAT.
goyalp
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Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Tue Sep 22, 2009 11:24 pm

Hello,

I was consistently scoring 680-690 on Manhattan Gmat exams (First Attempts
). I hit that score for about 4 straight exams. When I gave the GMAC PREP exam, my score was 640. On the day..my score dropped to 590 !!! Can the Manhattan moderators please help me explain the situation. At this time, I am not sure if I should continue the prep with Manhattan material or should I try different things.

If anyone else faced the same situation, please feel free to comment.

Puneet
robertrdzak
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by robertrdzak Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:53 am

The week before my actual exam I scored a 760 on a never before taken GMATPrep, (50Q and 41V). On the actual exam day though I scored a 660 (47Q and 35V). That is 100 points off my GMATPrep exam. I personally thought the Quant section was similar to the practice materials from GMAC and MGMAT but I found the verbal to be much more challenging than any material I used to practace.

Short story, yes it happens. good news is you are familiar with "exam like settings" and you can hopefully pound out weaknesses in Quant and Verbal. Not sure what else to do....
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Thu Sep 24, 2009 10:02 am

Thanks robertrdzak !!

I would appreciate if Manhattan Staff can comment and help clear the confusion.
tm03
 
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by tm03 Thu Sep 24, 2009 10:22 pm

I had even worse experience
Mgmat- 620
Gmatprep-600
Real Gmat-390
I have no idea what happened. Quant dropped little bit, but verbal was very very low on the real test. During the test, I felt I was doing just great. :( (very disappointed)
Any help???
Thank you
StaceyKoprince
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by StaceyKoprince Fri Sep 25, 2009 5:46 pm

If you took our course, then you're eligible for a free Post-Exam Assessment. This is a phone call with an instructor to figure out what went wrong and come up with a plan to re-take the test. If this applies to you, please send an email to studentservices@manhattangmat.com and request the Post-Exam Assessment.

Re: big drops in scores (100+ points), those are usually caused by some combination of:
1) major timing problems
2) major stamina problems
3) both

tm03, if you'd like to have a discussion about your problem, please start a new thread - you can copy and paste your original post from above and then also include the answers to the below questions. I just don't want to mix up info from two different people in one thread as I try to advise you - too confusing.

When you took the practice tests, did you also take the essays? Did you spend as much time and mental energy on the practice essays as you did on the real essays? Did you generally take the practice tests under full official conditions? (30m each for two essays, 8m break, 75m quant, 8m break, 75m verbal, at the same time of day as the real test)

How was your timing in each section? Did you generally move steadily through the test, giving appropriate time and attention to each question? (2m for quant, 1 to 1.25m for SC, 2m for CR, 2-4m to read a passage, 1m for general RC questions, 1.5 to 2m for specific RC questions) Or did you have to rush at times and possibly make random guesses? If you did have to rush and/or make random guesses, on how many questions would you say you did that? Did you do it on a lot of questions in a row or were the guesses scattered? Alternatively, did you move too quickly and finish with a lot of time (>3min) left over?

How was your stamina? How did you feel toward the middle and end of the verbal section? Did you have something to eat and drink on the breaks? Did you get up, walk around, and stretch?

Did you do anything or have anything happen in the final week that would have messed up your stamina? Examples: taking a practice test within 5 days of the real test, not getting enough sleep or not having a steady sleeping schedule, an extra stressful work or life event / environment, studying for more than 2 hours on the day before the real test or the day before that, studying for more than 30 minutes on the day of the real test, etc.

What other differences can you think of between your practice test experiences and your real test experiences? Anything, no matter how small, and no matter whether you think it wouldn't have made a difference to your score. Any differences at all?
Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
goyalp
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Sat Sep 26, 2009 12:09 pm

Hey Stacey,

Thanks for the reply.

To answer you questions, I am sure the situations cant be exact same in comparison to when I gave the prep exam. But in that case GMAT is more about mental strengh than your real Math and English Content test. The last 3 prep exams I practised was including Exam questions as well.

At the end of Exam, I felt decent about it (The same as I felt after prep exam). I was just shocked to see that mark as I just seen that mark in my Kaplan Exam series.. but nothing close to marks in GMACprep or MGMAT Exams.

-Puneet
StaceyKoprince
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by StaceyKoprince Mon Sep 28, 2009 11:28 am

Okay - if you did take the course, then sign up for a post-exam assessment right away. If you didn't and would like to try to figure out what went wrong here in the forums, then please reply to my questions above in as much detail as you can. If you want to avoid something similar happening again in future, then it's important to figure out what happened and why it happened.
Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
goyalp
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Mon Sep 28, 2009 6:59 pm

When you took the practice tests, did you also take the essays? YES
Did you spend as much time and mental energy on the practice essays as you did on the real essays? YES
Did you generally take the practice tests under full official conditions? YES
How was your timing in each section? Math timing was good. Verbal
had 2-3 questions short but I guessed the last 2-3 randomly in time.

Or did you have to rush at times and possibly make random guess ? I had to make random guesses on SC and RC. I would say 2-3 SC and RC each.And my guesses were scattered
How was your stamina ? I was waiting for the exam to finish soon. I was exausted in erbal section [When about 20 minutes left].
How did you feel toward the middle and end of the verbal section? I found SCs to be harder than expected. End of verbal section, I thought I did as usual.
section? Did you have something to eat and drink on the breaks? Did you get up, walk around, and stretch? YES
Did you do anything or have anything happen in the final week that would have messed up your stamina? Sleeping Scedhule was changed as I had a week off from work.
An extra stressful work or life ? Yes, but I had that going during mock tests as well.
Studying for more than 2 hours on the day before the real test ? I gave 1 mockup test on the day before test. Also, I studied for AWA for about 3-4 Hours. Also, studied for around 2 hours on the day of the exam.
goyalp
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:44 am

Hello Stacey,

Moving forward, I have booked my GMAT exam for Oct 24. So, I have just about 3 weeks left to the exam. However, I can devote full time hours since I have 3 weeks vacation from work. Please advise the approach and study plan I should inhibit.

Your thoughts and guidance is appreciated.

Thanks.

Puneet
goyalp
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:21 am

Hello Stacey,

Sorry for bits and pieces. I just read through the forums of other people and noticed many people improving with these postings. I just wanted to add more information, so it can clear things further.

My real GMAT score was Math -50, Verb - 23/24 .

My verbal score is about the same as what I got in my first GMAT mock test (with a week's prep). I personally beleive I have learnt many more concepts and tips since that. In the latest mock tests, I always scored in the range of 32-35 for verbal.

Another thing I would like to add, I was late for my verbal section after the break. For some reason the test center's finger machine was not detecting my fingure prints correctly and they ended up wasting my 1-2 minz of exam time. But I dont think I went into any panic state.

I cannot afford anything less than 700. Please advise.

P.S. Timing for Verbal is one of the things, I have problem in. I have read one of your long "timing" forum and will try to meet those time deadlines.
goyalp
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Sun Oct 04, 2009 8:11 pm

Hello Stacey,

The following is the study plan that I have formulated. Please advice if anything seems out of place. As I mentioned in the previous post, I will be putting full time hours [due to vacation] into the remaining days. [Exam Date: Oct 24].

Note: In error Logbook, I will be keeping track of type/reasons of mistakes that I am making everyday for all the following practice.


5-Oct

1) Review all Chapters- Manahttan Gmat Sentence Correction (SC) [With 5 OG Questions for each chapter]


6-Oct

1) Build a personal RC stratergy and keep testing till it works.


7-Oct

1) Review all Chapters- Manahttan Gmat CR [With 5 OG Questions for each chapter]


8-Oct

1) PowerPREP 1
2) Exam Review


9-Oct

SC- 40 Questions [OG-12]
RC- 10/12 RCs [OG-12]
CR- 40 Questions [OG-12]


10-Oct

MGMAT Exam
Exam Review


11-Oct

SC- 45 Questions [OG-12]
RC- 12 RCs [OG-12]
CR- 45 Questions [OG-12]


12-Oct

1) Review Error Logbook
2) Review Exams
3) Practice Weaknesses


13-Oct

1) GMAC 1
2) Exam Review


14-Oct

SC- 45 Questions [OG-12]
RC- 12 RCs [OG-12]
CR- 45 Questions [OG-12]

15-Oct

1) MGMAT Exam
2) Exam Review


16-Oct

SC- 45 Questions [OG-12]
RC- 12 RCs [OG-12]
CR- 45 Questions [OG-12]


17-Oct

1) PowerPREP 2
2) Exam Review


18-Oct

SC- 45 Questions [OG-11]
RC- 12 RCs [OG-11]
CR- 45 Questions [OG-11]


19-Oct

1) GMAC 2
2) Exam Review


20-Oct

SC- 45 Questions [OG-11]
RC- 12 RCs [OG-11]
CR- 45 Questions [OG-11]


21-Oct

SC- 45 Questions [OG-11]
RC- 12 RCs [OG-11]
CR- 45 Questions [OG-11]


22-Oct

Review Error Log
Review All Exams
Review AWA


23-Oct

Manhattan Flash Cards


24-Oct - EXAM DAY


I am aware that in your other posts you have recommended t-7 to be the last day for any exam practice. But since I have very few days available till exam and can devote full time hours, I have a last exam at t-5.

Please feel free to critique anything and everything. Your time and effort is very much appreciated.

Thanks again.
StaceyKoprince
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by StaceyKoprince Mon Oct 05, 2009 6:53 pm

Okay:

Good on the error log / notebook. This is going to be critical, because you feel you've learned the material, but you're still obviously making lots of mistakes somewhere. You need to figure out WHY you're still making those mistakes!

I would rather have you spreading out your early review over multiple days - do some SC, CR, and RC review each day, rather than all SC one day and all CR another day. Your brain is literally going to get tired of SC; it needs the variety to help keep it interested. (And it's important to keep your brain sharp in order to help you build good memories.)

Don't study for more than 2 hours at one time. Take at least a one hour break (preferably two hours) before you start studying again. Your brain needs this break in order to encode information into long term memory appropriately.

Don't take practice tests more frequently than once a week. The practice test is how you tell what your current scoring level is, and how you devise a study plan based on your strengths and weaknesses. The practice test itself is NOT how you get better. It's okay to have a practice test at T-5, though not closer to the real test than that.

Don't focus so much on quantity; the quality of your review is far more important. In a 2-hour study session, do practice problems for about 30-40 minutes and spend all of the rest of the time reviewing those problems. Part of that review will involve the error log - thinking about why you made an error and what you can do to avoid making that error again. Part of the review will also involve returning to your MGMAT strategy guides (and whatever other books you're using) to review rules or techniques.

If you have any questions on the timing post you read, please feel free to reply to that post and ask your questions. You may also want to take a look at this thread for some additional advice about the quality of study / how to study topic:

http://www.manhattangmat.com/forums/advice-on-approaching-extra-og-questions-and-more-t5723.html

I have a couple of posts in that thread - just scroll down to read them. Also, don't forget to check back in here to let us know how things are going and to ask more questions!
Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
goyalp
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Mon Oct 12, 2009 12:24 am

I studied for the past week as per your suggestions. I focused more on the quality rather on the quantity.

In the last week, I did:

1) SC: First 80 problems from OG
2) RC: First 13-14 passages with 3 questions in each [OG]
3) CR: First 25 problems from OG
4) Manhattan Math Flash Cards
5) MGMAT Exam

MGMAT score: 680 (Q47, V 35)

Highlights of the exam:

Verbal

1) Questions 10 to 14 - all wrong in a row. (1 SC 700 level, 3 CR 700 level, 1 SC 600 level)

2) Questions 16 to 19 - all wrong in a row. ( 2 RC 600 level, 2 CR 500 level)

3) When on question 24, I realized I was going real short of time. I random guessed question 25 in 35 sec and got it right [It was CR 700]

4) Got question 26 wrong [CR 600 in 2 min 22 sec].

5) Randomly Guessed: Question 28 [ CR 600 in 12 sec and got it right] , Question 30 [CR 700 in 16 sec and got it right] and Question 32 [ CR 700 in 3 sec and got it right]

6) Ended with two 700 questions CR and then SC. Got both wrong.

VERBAl Synopsis

I improved alot on SC's timing and accuracy, and RC's accuracy. However, I still need to practice more on 600/700 levels. CR, that I consider to be the strongest section is pulling me down.

Math

1) Got timed out on last question and got 2nd last and 3rd last questions wrong.

2) To the surprize, one question repeated in the same test.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So clearly, my verbal score of 35 is not a real estimate as I got 3 CR questions right with fluke. I plan to continue practicing OG questions and give another exam in 2 days.

Please suggest. Thanks.
goyalp
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Thu Oct 15, 2009 5:02 pm

Hello Stacey,

I did the following in last week:

1) 60 SC with logs and all recommeded ways to disect them. [ Feel very confident after this. Still have to complete the remaning problems of OG after 100]

2) 70 CR's - 40 from back of each chapter of manhattan book and 30 from OG.
[Still have remaining 55 CRs from OG , problems past number 75]
[ Was one of my strongest section but get nervous and confused about the answer choices very quick, during the exam. Maybe I am just used to solve the easy ones, not the hard ones ---- Any tips to improve this section ?]

3) RC - 5 [Was the slowest and weakest section - Very comfortable with RCs now]

4) GMATPrep Exam 1 ( Q 49, V 31) [Didnt have repeates from any Verbal questions from prior tests or OG 11]

I am very much dissapointed with verbal mark.
I have scored 680 (V-35) in MGMAT for last 2-3 times but have never passed the level of 640 in GMATprep till this exam. So, I consider GMATprep Verbal Section to be much harder.

For past 2 weeks, I have just took two exam: MGMAT (680), GMATPrep (660)
The other exam results are from few months bk when I did the prep for the 1st attempt.

Highlights of GMATprep Verbal :

1) Got the first and third question wrong.
2) By third question was very nervous about the time as I spent alot of time in those 3 quesitions.
3) Other wrongs: 7, 14, 20, 21, 25,26,27,29, 36,37
4) Did not feel exaused at the end of the section and was expecting much better result.

I did very well timewise for first time; I was going steadily by benchmarks and completed on time.

Please recommend me the things I should focus for next 8/9 days. I have an exam on this 24 and last mock exam attempt would be on 19, as recommended by you.

Any advice is appreciable. Thanks.
goyalp
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Re: Drop from 690 to 590 !

by goyalp Thu Oct 15, 2009 9:49 pm

Sorry wasnt clear on what I got for the last GMATprep. I got 660 ( Q -49, V - 31)