hi
i'm writing this post in a bit of desperation, I really don't know what to do anymore. I have been studying for this exam now for over 2 years and feel like im completely stuck. i took the exam last november and got q37 v35 for a 580 in total. i was getting Q42 and V42-V44 on the MGMAT practice tests at that time.
im really stressed out about it all now as the R1 deadlines are almost over and there's no way im ready to retake the exam again. it seems as if i actually am not able to beat this exam. i feel like i'll be lucky to hit R2. my target is 700+. I can't wait until next year to apply because im almost 31.
i feel like im making no improvement, and im trying to review questions like has been advised and i often will end up stuck on one question for 30 minutes, which is not a productive study session. then before i konw it, its 1130pm on a week night, and i've not achieved much. im even thinking i should resign from my job in order to try to focus on this and free up more time, as im wanting to do an MBA for a career change anyway, and my job is just getting in the way of the GMAT.
i just dont know what study strategy i should use. i try one, i try another, and i still dont improve. ive tried using an error log, but its really time consuming. then i'll think there's a better way of doing it and then overhaul the log. then ill start to lose motivation as im not getting anywhere, and its a bit of a vicious cycle...
i really have a lack of confidence as to what study plan and strategy to stick to. i think that's the crux of my problem. i also forget stuff regularly and topics i learnt a while ago are now hazy. but i almost cant bear to go back and revise the same old content over and over...
many sources mention this exam shouldn't take more than 2-3 months to study for. im obviously doing something very, very wrong. i do work full time and commute up to 2.5 hours a day, which leaves me tired by the end of the day, and it is really hard to focus and stay motivated for 2-3 hours after work.
i remember seeing a post on this site from someone else who had been studying for a similar amount of time and was in a similar situation, but i cant find it now - how did they end up going on the exam? did they manage to sort themselves out for it?
thanks
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- rkafc81
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- StaceyKoprince
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
I'm sorry you're having such a tough struggle with this test. I'll address some of your more specific points below, but overall, it might be the case that you need to work with a private tutor to try to diagnose what's going wrong with your various approaches and to figure out how to get things going in the right direction. You could also get some level of personalized attention by taking a course, and that would be less expensive, but that would also take longer. You say you've been doing this for 2 years - so, at this point, it would be best to try to get some answers and direction more quickly, if you can afford the fees. Then, if you do need more ongoing direction, you could choose to join a course at that point and just add some individual tutoring as needed to save on costs (vs. doing all tutoring).
I want to make clear that I normally try to avoid recommending tutoring both because it's very expensive and because I work for a company that offers tutoring, so I have a conflict of interest. If I actually recommend tutoring myself (as opposed to responding to someone's question about tutoring), that's because I really think that it would be best in this situation.
I would specifically NOT recommend taking time off of work - not yet. Right now, what you're doing isn't working, so spending more time doing what's not working isn't really going to help.
Now, it's possible that after a few sessions with the tutor, s/he will realize that you really are too fried from your job and you do need to take time off in order to devote yourself to studying - but let's make sure that that's actually necessary first, because that's a major step to take. Most people don't need to do that.
Next, the fact that you're almost 31 does not mean that you can't apply next year. I have had plenty of students (and friends) who've started an MBA program at a later age. Yes, it's the case that the majority of regular full-time MBA students are in their late 20s, but not all. Please don't add that kind of pressure to yourself - that just makes it even harder to study / concentrate.
I also wouldn't say that the exam "shouldn't take more than 2-3 months." Most people take somewhere between 2 and 4 months, that's true, with most of those at the later end of that range (3-4 months). But plenty of people take more time than that.
It also sounds like you are both burned out and stressed out, both by the exam and by trying to study after a long day at work (and a long commute). So we need to try to address that as well - and, again, this is something that a tutor could do for you, help you learn how and when to study, how to be more efficient with your limited time, etc.
In terms of finding / choosing a tutor, explore multiple options and try to have an email or phone conversation with the possible tutors. Explain your situation, ask questions, and listen to what s/he has to say. You want to find someone who really listens to you, who responds to what you say and what you need (as opposed to just taking some formulaic approach that they use with everyone), and with whom you have a "connection" - you feel comfortable with the person, saying what's on your mind, and you can understand whatever it is that the person is trying to explain to you.
And, of course, please come back here and ask any questions, share any doubts or concerns, etc.
I want to make clear that I normally try to avoid recommending tutoring both because it's very expensive and because I work for a company that offers tutoring, so I have a conflict of interest. If I actually recommend tutoring myself (as opposed to responding to someone's question about tutoring), that's because I really think that it would be best in this situation.
I would specifically NOT recommend taking time off of work - not yet. Right now, what you're doing isn't working, so spending more time doing what's not working isn't really going to help.
Now, it's possible that after a few sessions with the tutor, s/he will realize that you really are too fried from your job and you do need to take time off in order to devote yourself to studying - but let's make sure that that's actually necessary first, because that's a major step to take. Most people don't need to do that.
Next, the fact that you're almost 31 does not mean that you can't apply next year. I have had plenty of students (and friends) who've started an MBA program at a later age. Yes, it's the case that the majority of regular full-time MBA students are in their late 20s, but not all. Please don't add that kind of pressure to yourself - that just makes it even harder to study / concentrate.
I also wouldn't say that the exam "shouldn't take more than 2-3 months." Most people take somewhere between 2 and 4 months, that's true, with most of those at the later end of that range (3-4 months). But plenty of people take more time than that.
It also sounds like you are both burned out and stressed out, both by the exam and by trying to study after a long day at work (and a long commute). So we need to try to address that as well - and, again, this is something that a tutor could do for you, help you learn how and when to study, how to be more efficient with your limited time, etc.
In terms of finding / choosing a tutor, explore multiple options and try to have an email or phone conversation with the possible tutors. Explain your situation, ask questions, and listen to what s/he has to say. You want to find someone who really listens to you, who responds to what you say and what you need (as opposed to just taking some formulaic approach that they use with everyone), and with whom you have a "connection" - you feel comfortable with the person, saying what's on your mind, and you can understand whatever it is that the person is trying to explain to you.
And, of course, please come back here and ask any questions, share any doubts or concerns, etc.
Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
- rkafc81
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
hi Stacey
thanks for your reply
I've signed up for an online course and also getting some tutoring too
I have a question, after some serious reflection on where I may be going wrong, I've identified that poor calculation habits with manually-intensive processes are letting me down big time...
here's a quick list of just some of the errors I've made in this week alone. I knew exactly the strategy to use for each question in which I made these errors, but all of these errors were critical (i.e. caused me to get the question wrong). This stuff must be costing me dearly in Quant, I reckon by at least 3-4 points... I'm currently on around Q40-Q43... I also have timing issues which I've realised is also hurting my score, so I'm working on that using your timing articles.
I'm sure you've had students in the past with these problems so it would be great to discuss a course of action to rectify them. I'm actually feeling positive now that I've finally identified this as being a major problem, as I know at least a part of why I've not been improving. I just an't believe I've not really paid attention to it until now...!
3/4(120 + x) = x... I cancelled out the 4 and the 120 --> 3(30 + x) = x... I know now (in hindsight, and after trying to work out why i got the problem wrong) that I should have distributed first to get 3/4(120 + x) --> 3/4(120) + 3/4(x) BEFORE doing anything else in the calculation, but I couldn't see that when I did the question...
9/(7+2*3) = 9 / (7+6) = 9/15 ...
13*4 = 42...
4x = 5
--> x = 4/5
I think I really need to practice drills or something with common, manually-intensive calculations such as these in order to build GOOD habits (as I have many bad habits - in fact, I never really learnt good habits with lots of these types of calculations (even in high school would you believe!) - I always just did them in my head. Same with that exponents error example above...) ...
it's pretty clear to me now that under time pressure I'm not thinking through each step and rushing through them by doing stuff in my head a lot instead of writing out each step properly (it seems though that writing out each step is very time-consuming??).
I'm just mindlessly going through the motions of solving the calculations, and it seems I really need to develop good habits, structure and a disciplined methodology of processes/steps when solving calculations or manually-intensive scratchwork involving algebra etc....
any ideas from your side as to what to do here?
thanks
thanks for your reply
I've signed up for an online course and also getting some tutoring too
I have a question, after some serious reflection on where I may be going wrong, I've identified that poor calculation habits with manually-intensive processes are letting me down big time...
here's a quick list of just some of the errors I've made in this week alone. I knew exactly the strategy to use for each question in which I made these errors, but all of these errors were critical (i.e. caused me to get the question wrong). This stuff must be costing me dearly in Quant, I reckon by at least 3-4 points... I'm currently on around Q40-Q43... I also have timing issues which I've realised is also hurting my score, so I'm working on that using your timing articles.
I'm sure you've had students in the past with these problems so it would be great to discuss a course of action to rectify them. I'm actually feeling positive now that I've finally identified this as being a major problem, as I know at least a part of why I've not been improving. I just an't believe I've not really paid attention to it until now...!
3/4(120 + x) = x... I cancelled out the 4 and the 120 --> 3(30 + x) = x... I know now (in hindsight, and after trying to work out why i got the problem wrong) that I should have distributed first to get 3/4(120 + x) --> 3/4(120) + 3/4(x) BEFORE doing anything else in the calculation, but I couldn't see that when I did the question...
9/(7+2*3) = 9 / (7+6) = 9/15 ...
13*4 = 42...
4x = 5
--> x = 4/5
I think I really need to practice drills or something with common, manually-intensive calculations such as these in order to build GOOD habits (as I have many bad habits - in fact, I never really learnt good habits with lots of these types of calculations (even in high school would you believe!) - I always just did them in my head. Same with that exponents error example above...) ...
it's pretty clear to me now that under time pressure I'm not thinking through each step and rushing through them by doing stuff in my head a lot instead of writing out each step properly (it seems though that writing out each step is very time-consuming??).
I'm just mindlessly going through the motions of solving the calculations, and it seems I really need to develop good habits, structure and a disciplined methodology of processes/steps when solving calculations or manually-intensive scratchwork involving algebra etc....
any ideas from your side as to what to do here?
thanks
- StaceyKoprince
- ManhattanGMAT Staff
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- Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2005 9:05 am
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
This is a great thing to discuss with your tutor as well and in class! Also read this:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... -the-gmat/
This one's a PEMDAS error - P = parentheses first, so that was your clue to distribute. Maybe you need to do some PEMDAS drills from Foundations of Math to help solidify these instincts.
Also, you could get in the habit of writing it like this: (3/4)(120+x). That makes it easier to remember to distribute first.
Drills again. Multiplication tables this time. Also, one way to multiply by 4 is to multiply by 2 twice - write it out each time. 13*2 = 26, 26*2 = 52. We tend to make fewer mistakes when multiplying by 2.
Was there anything messy in your writing? Did you possibly accidentally mentally pick up the 9 instead of the 7 (9 + 6 = 15)? If that could have happened, pick up your non-writing hand and physically cover up everything except what you're focused on (7+6).
That can help here too:
Also, here, you can literally write out the step the way we did when we first learned algebra:
4x = 5
and then draw a line under each side and write 4 under each. Cross off the 4s on the left side and that leaves you with x = 5/4.
A lot of times, this stuff can be remedied by the way in which we write stuff out, so think about how you can write things in a better way, eg: (3/4) instead of 3/4, or how you can write out things that you're not writing out right now, eg: literally dividing both sides by 4.
Not if you're writing while you're thinking, the whole time. Also, the time is worth it, if not writing it out causes you to make mistakes on things you can already do! Finally, you don't literally need to write out every last thing for everything, but you DO need to do it on things were you know you're likely to make a mistake. That's part of the reason why it's so important to keep track of when / how you personally tend to make careless mistakes.
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... -the-gmat/
3/4(120 + x) = x... I cancelled out the 4 and the 120 --> 3(30 + x) = x...
This one's a PEMDAS error - P = parentheses first, so that was your clue to distribute. Maybe you need to do some PEMDAS drills from Foundations of Math to help solidify these instincts.
Also, you could get in the habit of writing it like this: (3/4)(120+x). That makes it easier to remember to distribute first.
13*4 = 42...
Drills again. Multiplication tables this time. Also, one way to multiply by 4 is to multiply by 2 twice - write it out each time. 13*2 = 26, 26*2 = 52. We tend to make fewer mistakes when multiplying by 2.
9/(7+2*3) = 9 / (7+6) = 9/15
Was there anything messy in your writing? Did you possibly accidentally mentally pick up the 9 instead of the 7 (9 + 6 = 15)? If that could have happened, pick up your non-writing hand and physically cover up everything except what you're focused on (7+6).
That can help here too:
4x = 5
--> x = 4/5
Also, here, you can literally write out the step the way we did when we first learned algebra:
4x = 5
and then draw a line under each side and write 4 under each. Cross off the 4s on the left side and that leaves you with x = 5/4.
A lot of times, this stuff can be remedied by the way in which we write stuff out, so think about how you can write things in a better way, eg: (3/4) instead of 3/4, or how you can write out things that you're not writing out right now, eg: literally dividing both sides by 4.
it seems though that writing out each step is very time-consuming??
Not if you're writing while you're thinking, the whole time. Also, the time is worth it, if not writing it out causes you to make mistakes on things you can already do! Finally, you don't literally need to write out every last thing for everything, but you DO need to do it on things were you know you're likely to make a mistake. That's part of the reason why it's so important to keep track of when / how you personally tend to make careless mistakes.
Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
- rkafc81
- Course Students
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- Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2010 2:39 am
Re: 2 years, and still stuck
Hi Stacey,
I ended up getting some tutoring from Ron and I've really improved, also your help on this forum has been really helpful and I discovered timing was a huge issue for me. I've really worked on that issue and my practice scores jumped heaps. However all of this may not be enough before the GMAT (which I'm taking on Monday)... If I had another 3-4 weeks I'd be definitely ok for my target of 700+ with a q46+ as I'd have more time to practice the techniques, strategies etc. from Ron. I'm on around Q44-47 now on practice tests and i should get around V38-42 on test day depending how I go. so fingers crossed really!
I got REALLY fatigued halfway through verbal on my last pracitce exam (I also did the essays and IR before Quant and Verbal - this was the 2nd test that I did the IR section in so I knew what to expect the second time around) and couldn't concentrate or focus properly... Do you have any tips on how to avoid that?
My main question on this post though is around being almost 31 etc. and your reply to that:
... were any of those people accepted into say a top-tier program MIT or Stanford ? what sort of age range were they in? were their backgrounds exceptional (mine's good but not out of this world good!)? was age a big risk for their applications?
thanks!
I ended up getting some tutoring from Ron and I've really improved, also your help on this forum has been really helpful and I discovered timing was a huge issue for me. I've really worked on that issue and my practice scores jumped heaps. However all of this may not be enough before the GMAT (which I'm taking on Monday)... If I had another 3-4 weeks I'd be definitely ok for my target of 700+ with a q46+ as I'd have more time to practice the techniques, strategies etc. from Ron. I'm on around Q44-47 now on practice tests and i should get around V38-42 on test day depending how I go. so fingers crossed really!
I got REALLY fatigued halfway through verbal on my last pracitce exam (I also did the essays and IR before Quant and Verbal - this was the 2nd test that I did the IR section in so I knew what to expect the second time around) and couldn't concentrate or focus properly... Do you have any tips on how to avoid that?
My main question on this post though is around being almost 31 etc. and your reply to that:
Next, the fact that you're almost 31 does not mean that you can't apply next year. I have had plenty of students (and friends) who've started an MBA program at a later age. Yes, it's the case that the majority of regular full-time MBA students are in their late 20s, but not all. Please don't add that kind of pressure to yourself - that just makes it even harder to study / concentrate.
... were any of those people accepted into say a top-tier program MIT or Stanford ? what sort of age range were they in? were their backgrounds exceptional (mine's good but not out of this world good!)? was age a big risk for their applications?
thanks!
- melissa.agresta
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
Sorry to jump in here, but I was just reading your concern about being 31 and was perplexed a bit as I am 35, and age never did cross my mind. I cant imagine being 31 as a negative for admission, and actually I see it as being a positive. You are more mature and certain in what you want. You have had more time to experience a career and make a choice. I work for a University, and there are people all around me getting Masters/PHDS who are in their 50s!! It is never too late to follow your dream, and you are never too old for anything.
- rkafc81
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
Thanks Melissa that was very inspiring! i guess i've been reading too many admissions consultant blogs and have got somewhat confused about this. I've been reading a blog called mbaover30.com and it has really helped me on this topic, the guy has got interviews at quite a few top schools this admissions season! Well, i kinda have no choice now anyway as i messed up the gmat today and had to cancel my score, and cant retake it for another 30 days, so i will either have to apply in r3 or wait til next year. Which in a strange way is a relief.
- StaceyKoprince
- ManhattanGMAT Staff
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
Hi, sorry I'm just getting to this now - I've been traveling since the 11th! I hope things went well on your test.
Re: dealing with fatigue, it's important to:
(1) take practice tests under 100% official conditions
(2) learn how to take the essay and IR sections in such a way that you get a good enough score while exerting only the necessary energy / brain power
(3) eat and drink on the breaks during the test; in particular, we recommend glucose (sugar!) on the break between quant and verbal. Glucose can help to give your brain short-term recovery from mental fatigue (but you don't want to do it before the test because it's only short-term - you crash after a period of time). Make sure it's real sugar, not the fake stuff - could be fresh juice, an energy drink, whatever, but make it in liquid form so it gets into your blood stream as quickly as possible.
(4) phsyically stretch / move on the breaks and even in the testing room (without leaving your chair or distracting others)
Re: age, yes, I've known many people who got into top programs at older ages than 31. You asked whether those people had exceptional backgrounds - everyone who gets into Stanford or MIT has something exceptional, regardless of age. So, yes - but not just because they're older.
Melissa, thanks so much for responding to a fellow student. :)
Oh, and I'm just reading your final post that you messed up your exam and cancelled your score. What did you mess up? If you want to discuss, let me know!
Re: dealing with fatigue, it's important to:
(1) take practice tests under 100% official conditions
(2) learn how to take the essay and IR sections in such a way that you get a good enough score while exerting only the necessary energy / brain power
(3) eat and drink on the breaks during the test; in particular, we recommend glucose (sugar!) on the break between quant and verbal. Glucose can help to give your brain short-term recovery from mental fatigue (but you don't want to do it before the test because it's only short-term - you crash after a period of time). Make sure it's real sugar, not the fake stuff - could be fresh juice, an energy drink, whatever, but make it in liquid form so it gets into your blood stream as quickly as possible.
(4) phsyically stretch / move on the breaks and even in the testing room (without leaving your chair or distracting others)
Re: age, yes, I've known many people who got into top programs at older ages than 31. You asked whether those people had exceptional backgrounds - everyone who gets into Stanford or MIT has something exceptional, regardless of age. So, yes - but not just because they're older.
Melissa, thanks so much for responding to a fellow student. :)
Oh, and I'm just reading your final post that you messed up your exam and cancelled your score. What did you mess up? If you want to discuss, let me know!
Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
- mukesh.mulchandani
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
To Melissa's point there are a lot of us 35+ year old out here and so age is by no means a factor. What could matter is if you are the sole bread maker for your family then full time MBA may not be an option if you do not have a lot of cash sitting in you bank accounts. That is when people consider alternate ways of getting MBA.
I, for example, am 35 year old with 10 years experience in computer industry and now looking at Executive MBA.
For you it may not be a bad idea to continue working for a couple of years while working on GMAT and then look at part time or Exec MBA.
My 2 cents worth.
I, for example, am 35 year old with 10 years experience in computer industry and now looking at Executive MBA.
For you it may not be a bad idea to continue working for a couple of years while working on GMAT and then look at part time or Exec MBA.
My 2 cents worth.
- StaceyKoprince
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
Thanks, mukesh - that's another good idea!
Stacey Koprince
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Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
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- rkafc81
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
StaceyKoprince Wrote:Hi, sorry I'm just getting to this now - I've been traveling since the 11th! I hope things went well on your test.
Re: dealing with fatigue, it's important to:
(1) take practice tests under 100% official conditions
(2) learn how to take the essay and IR sections in such a way that you get a good enough score while exerting only the necessary energy / brain power
(3) eat and drink on the breaks during the test; in particular, we recommend glucose (sugar!) on the break between quant and verbal. Glucose can help to give your brain short-term recovery from mental fatigue (but you don't want to do it before the test because it's only short-term - you crash after a period of time). Make sure it's real sugar, not the fake stuff - could be fresh juice, an energy drink, whatever, but make it in liquid form so it gets into your blood stream as quickly as possible.
(4) phsyically stretch / move on the breaks and even in the testing room (without leaving your chair or distracting others)
Re: age, yes, I've known many people who got into top programs at older ages than 31. You asked whether those people had exceptional backgrounds - everyone who gets into Stanford or MIT has something exceptional, regardless of age. So, yes - but not just because they're older.
Melissa, thanks so much for responding to a fellow student. :)
Oh, and I'm just reading your final post that you messed up your exam and cancelled your score. What did you mess up? If you want to discuss, let me know!
Hi Stacy - thanks for your reply.
I messed it up because I got flustered in IR and started "catastrophising" about the exam as a result. Then, I went into quant and was quite stressed and anxious, but that anxiety went down heaps when I realised "wow I can do these!". However, for some reason (I'm assuming stress), I forgot to monitor my timing closely. I checked the clock every 5 questions (q5 = 10 mins elapsed, q10 = 20 mins elapsed etc.) and thought I was doing ok. Then I realised when I'd done 20 questions that instead of 40 mins elapsing, I'd actually used up 55 mins... I don't know how I did that. So I made a gross miscalculation in on of the "check-in" times where I checked in to see that I was still on track, and miscalculated the time. By this stage I still had 17 questions left and 20 mins remaining on the clock. I tried to rush through some questions and guess them etc. and realised that I'd actually made a critical error in timing that I couldn't recover from. Instead of risking an abysmal score appearing on my GMAT record, I cancelled it.
I think there are two things standing in my way:
* test anxiety (major issue) - I went into the test very anxious, and when doing questions I had very bad breathing and anxiety and just couldn't focus as well as I normally could.
* bad timing (but I think that's purely related to test anxiety at this stage)
* stamina and endurance (in my practice tests, I was wiped out by the time I got halfway through verbal)
In hindsight, I think that the ridiculous amount of time I've been studying for this exam (before I got tutoring) with no real improvement has significantly contributed to my exam anxiety.
Also, I was putting huge pressure on myself thinking that I "just have to get 700+" otherwise I'd miss the school deadlines. Now, I actually have missed the R2 deadlines :( . But that's probably a good thing as it should minimise the anxiety next time I take it.
So, I've started mindfulness meditation now on a daily basis for 20 mins a day - this should help me relax and concentrate more too during the exam. Also, I aim to practice anxiety-reducing techniques like breathing and progressive muscle relaxation (I think you wrote an article about these techniques actually?).
On a positive note, I have finally realised that this exam is beatable and that I'm not "GMAT stupid". The psychological factors of this exam just cannot be underestimated! It's not really about how great you are with math or verbal, but about all the other stuff (timing, performance under pressure, question strategies, changing tack when stuck, giving up quickly when necessary etc.).
If I get 720+ I should be in good shape, regardless of my age, to apply this coming Fall in R1 or even take a shot at a R3 application or two.
Thanks!
- StaceyKoprince
- ManhattanGMAT Staff
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Re: 2 years, and still stuck
That was the right decision (to cancel). At that point, you knew that you were so far off from where you should have been that the best course of action was to try again.
Timing issues are definitely exacerbated by stress - but they're rarely 100% stress-related. In fact, stress is also exacerbated by timing issues - if you can make timing better, that will actually help reduce your stress. :)
So you've got the timing articles - keep working on that. The more solid your timing is, the more you'll know what to do to keep yourself on track, and the less the stress will spin out of control because of messed-up timing. The "In It To Win It" article will actually help a great deal with that, because the biggest time-related stress factor for most people is letting go of a question - picking an answer and moving on.
Here are some ideas that might help with stress management:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... anagement/
Re: stamina, read this:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... you-crazy/
Also, I've said this before, but I keep reading more and more about it: glucose helps your brain to recover some of its mental endurance. It needs to be delivered in liquid form (for a quick rush to your brain) and should be consumed right before the verbal section. The best source I know of is fresh fruit juice. Note that you do NOT want something with high-fructose corn syrup or any kind of artificial sweetener. Natural fructose is okay (fruit juices are actually a mix of natural fructose and natural glucose). But you really want natural glucose.
I agree 100% that this is not a "school" exam - it's not really about math, grammar, etc. Yes, we have to know those things, but the test is really testing you on what we call "executive reasoning skills" - all those things you described. If you know that, then you also know that the test really doesn't want you to get everything right, because it's trying to see how you react / perform when the going gets rough. So expect to get stuff wrong. The right reaction is to say, "Ha, you got me! That question is not going to happen for me. C is my favorite letter; now I'm moving on!"
Timing issues are definitely exacerbated by stress - but they're rarely 100% stress-related. In fact, stress is also exacerbated by timing issues - if you can make timing better, that will actually help reduce your stress. :)
So you've got the timing articles - keep working on that. The more solid your timing is, the more you'll know what to do to keep yourself on track, and the less the stress will spin out of control because of messed-up timing. The "In It To Win It" article will actually help a great deal with that, because the biggest time-related stress factor for most people is letting go of a question - picking an answer and moving on.
Here are some ideas that might help with stress management:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... anagement/
Re: stamina, read this:
http://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... you-crazy/
Also, I've said this before, but I keep reading more and more about it: glucose helps your brain to recover some of its mental endurance. It needs to be delivered in liquid form (for a quick rush to your brain) and should be consumed right before the verbal section. The best source I know of is fresh fruit juice. Note that you do NOT want something with high-fructose corn syrup or any kind of artificial sweetener. Natural fructose is okay (fruit juices are actually a mix of natural fructose and natural glucose). But you really want natural glucose.
I agree 100% that this is not a "school" exam - it's not really about math, grammar, etc. Yes, we have to know those things, but the test is really testing you on what we call "executive reasoning skills" - all those things you described. If you know that, then you also know that the test really doesn't want you to get everything right, because it's trying to see how you react / perform when the going gets rough. So expect to get stuff wrong. The right reaction is to say, "Ha, you got me! That question is not going to happen for me. C is my favorite letter; now I'm moving on!"
Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
- rkafc81
- Course Students
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2010 2:39 am
Re: 2 years, and still stuck
cool thanks Stacey- yeah in hindsight (and after reading your latest reply to this post) I've realised what I was doing in Quant that specifically caused my timing to be bad... I was doing the whole "I must get this one right" or "this isn't that hard" thing and sometimes spending too long on questions without realising it. I was also having trouble letting go of questions, with the fear that letting go of too many questions will result in my score suffering majorly and the difficulty of questions that the exam throws me next dropping as well...
how can i work on building up my confidence in knowing when to let go? do some practice exams and see what effect it has? I've unfortunately used up all of the MGMAT exams though and GMATPrep ones too... :(
thanks
how can i work on building up my confidence in knowing when to let go? do some practice exams and see what effect it has? I've unfortunately used up all of the MGMAT exams though and GMATPrep ones too... :(
thanks
- StaceyKoprince
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- Location: Montreal
Re: 2 years, and still stuck
Don't do new questions until you read that timing article and start developing the skills that it discusses. You might as well use older things for that at first until you start to get a rhythm going.
Next, when you feel any of these feelings:
- but I know how to do this
- but I studied this
- but I should be able to do this
- but I've invested so much time that I don't want to give up now
- but I'm not sure
- but...
Notice the theme? Any feeling that starts with "but" is really your brain's way of signaling to you, "Something's wrong! Right now! I don't know what I'm doing!"
You're still going to have those feelings in future. What you need to do is train yourself (or maybe re-train yourself!) to react in a different way.
Something's wrong. It doesn't matter that you did study this and that you normally do know how to do it and that you think it's really easy. You would be thinking NONE of these things if you actually knew how to do it. You'd just be doing it.
So when you start to have those feelings, you first need to let yourself recognize them consciously, not push them aside with growing unease.
Next, you need to be able to say to yourself, okay, this one's not happening. You got me. If you haven't used full time yet, then you have the luxury of thinking about how to make a guess. (And this is why you really need to acknowledge these feelings right away!) If you've already used your time or are even behind, you need to guess RIGHT NOW and move on.
Picture that tennis ball whizzing by you while you watch from 10 feet away. It doesn't matter that you're playing your 5-year-old cousin and you should be destroying him. He just won that one particular point. Move on.
:)
(And once you start to get some momentum with all of that, you can start to do new problem sets out of OG, GMATPrep, wherever.)
Don't do another practice test for at least a couple of weeks. You know what you need to work on without spending 3.5 hours taking a test. Don't go over those old test questions either - start to forget them. You can recycle those tests eventually as long as you give yourself time to forget most of the material!
Next, when you feel any of these feelings:
- but I know how to do this
- but I studied this
- but I should be able to do this
- but I've invested so much time that I don't want to give up now
- but I'm not sure
- but...
Notice the theme? Any feeling that starts with "but" is really your brain's way of signaling to you, "Something's wrong! Right now! I don't know what I'm doing!"
You're still going to have those feelings in future. What you need to do is train yourself (or maybe re-train yourself!) to react in a different way.
Something's wrong. It doesn't matter that you did study this and that you normally do know how to do it and that you think it's really easy. You would be thinking NONE of these things if you actually knew how to do it. You'd just be doing it.
So when you start to have those feelings, you first need to let yourself recognize them consciously, not push them aside with growing unease.
Next, you need to be able to say to yourself, okay, this one's not happening. You got me. If you haven't used full time yet, then you have the luxury of thinking about how to make a guess. (And this is why you really need to acknowledge these feelings right away!) If you've already used your time or are even behind, you need to guess RIGHT NOW and move on.
Picture that tennis ball whizzing by you while you watch from 10 feet away. It doesn't matter that you're playing your 5-year-old cousin and you should be destroying him. He just won that one particular point. Move on.
:)
(And once you start to get some momentum with all of that, you can start to do new problem sets out of OG, GMATPrep, wherever.)
Don't do another practice test for at least a couple of weeks. You know what you need to work on without spending 3.5 hours taking a test. Don't go over those old test questions either - start to forget them. You can recycle those tests eventually as long as you give yourself time to forget most of the material!
Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
Instructor
Director, Content & Curriculum
ManhattanPrep
- rkafc81
- Course Students
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2010 2:39 am
Re: 2 years, and still stuck
cool thanks Stacey
i think my biggest concern during the exam was that when this happened (and now I realise that I was doing this heaps) -->
"Next, when you feel any of these feelings:
- but I know how to do this
- but I studied this
- but I should be able to do this
- but I've invested so much time that I don't want to give up now
- but I'm not sure
- but..."
... i would get worried that if i let this question go, i may not know the next one either, and mess up on a couple after that etc. - and then totally mess up the exam. it was really catastrophic thinking now that i am thinking about it, but i can't quite put my finger on exactly what i mean by that. i guess this is a confidence thing but i can see i just need to trust myself when this happens and just move on, asap.
realistically, how many questions is acceptable to give up and guess on during the exam? 10?
so yea, so i will work on the timing stuff as a priority now, and knowing when to let go, as well as brush up and practice SC, CR and RC questions, and IR, and then take a practice exam in real-test conditions at my local university's library.
re: practice tests - good idea - i'm not going to re-do or review any of the MGMAT tests I did in the lead up to my bad test day - i will use them as practice tests only and hopefully i will have forgotten a lot of the content in those tests by now.
i think though that i do need to start doing practice tests every 2 weeks or so though so that I can help kill my nerves on exam day and be 100% prepared. but i will leave it for a bit before i do another one (and work on all the issues I've identified).
also, I've booked in to see a psychologist for my anxiety/stress related problems over this exam as they were seriously affecting my ability to focus (extreme I know but I have realised I've got myself in quite a pickle about this exam and a negative-thinking cycle), and I'll also go over the articles you posted about this topic. have also been exercising a fair bit which has helped a lot too.
i am pretty sure i haven't forgotten too much content though which is good - it's been over a month now since i did any GMAT study (probably a good thing though - i needed a break from it), but I don't feel like I've forgotten too much.
i'm feeling a bit like i don't know where to and how to pick up my studies again though after this break... any tips on that?
thanks again!
i think my biggest concern during the exam was that when this happened (and now I realise that I was doing this heaps) -->
"Next, when you feel any of these feelings:
- but I know how to do this
- but I studied this
- but I should be able to do this
- but I've invested so much time that I don't want to give up now
- but I'm not sure
- but..."
... i would get worried that if i let this question go, i may not know the next one either, and mess up on a couple after that etc. - and then totally mess up the exam. it was really catastrophic thinking now that i am thinking about it, but i can't quite put my finger on exactly what i mean by that. i guess this is a confidence thing but i can see i just need to trust myself when this happens and just move on, asap.
realistically, how many questions is acceptable to give up and guess on during the exam? 10?
so yea, so i will work on the timing stuff as a priority now, and knowing when to let go, as well as brush up and practice SC, CR and RC questions, and IR, and then take a practice exam in real-test conditions at my local university's library.
re: practice tests - good idea - i'm not going to re-do or review any of the MGMAT tests I did in the lead up to my bad test day - i will use them as practice tests only and hopefully i will have forgotten a lot of the content in those tests by now.
i think though that i do need to start doing practice tests every 2 weeks or so though so that I can help kill my nerves on exam day and be 100% prepared. but i will leave it for a bit before i do another one (and work on all the issues I've identified).
also, I've booked in to see a psychologist for my anxiety/stress related problems over this exam as they were seriously affecting my ability to focus (extreme I know but I have realised I've got myself in quite a pickle about this exam and a negative-thinking cycle), and I'll also go over the articles you posted about this topic. have also been exercising a fair bit which has helped a lot too.
i am pretty sure i haven't forgotten too much content though which is good - it's been over a month now since i did any GMAT study (probably a good thing though - i needed a break from it), but I don't feel like I've forgotten too much.
i'm feeling a bit like i don't know where to and how to pick up my studies again though after this break... any tips on that?
thanks again!